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ALL RIGHT.[Community Services Committee on April 4, 2023.]
ON TUESDAY, APRIL 4TH, 2023.THIS IS A MEETING OF THE COMMUNITY SERVICES COMMITTEE.
I AM CHAIR DEBORAH MORRIS AND WITH ME ARE COMMITTEE MEMBERS, ED MOORE FROM DISTRICT THREE, AND MARGARET LUCK FROM DISTRICT FIVE.
AND WE HAVE VERY STAFF MEMBERS WITH US AS WELL.
UH, SO WE'LL GO AHEAD AND START ON THE AGENDA, STARTING WITH APPROVAL OF MINUTES FROM THE MARCH 7TH, 2023 MEETING.
UM, COMMITTEE MEMBERS, HAVE YOU HAD A CHANCE TO GLANCE OVER THEM? MOVE TO APPROVE.
APPROVED UNANIMOUSLY, UH, PUBLIC COMMENTS.
DO WE HAVE ANY MEMBERS OF THE PUBLIC HERE? NO, MA'AM.
ITEM THREE IS TO DISCUSS MULTI-FAMILY PROPERTY AC REQUIREMENTS.
AS YOU KNOW, WE HAVE BEEN, UH, TRYING TO WORK OUR WAY THROUGH THIS AND PREPARE A DRAFT ORDINANCE, UH, THAT'S NUANCED TO, UH, HIT THE PROBLEM AND NOT, UM, NOT OVERSHOOT, NOT CAUSE UNINTENDED CONSEQUENCES, THINGS LIKE THAT.
UM, ONE THING I WILL SAY IS, UH, AND, AND I'VE BEEN HEARING BACK AND FORTH FROM THE, UH, APARTMENT ASSOCIATION OF GREATER DALLAS, AND ONE OF THE THINGS THAT, UM, THEY BROUGHT TO MY ATTENTION WAS THAT THERE IS A BILL IN MOTION, UM, AT STATE LEVEL TO, UH, TO MAKE FIXING APARTMENT AC ISSUES A PRIORITY.
AND IT'S VERY SIMILAR, INTERESTINGLY ENOUGH, TO WHAT WE HAVE BEEN DISCUSSING HERE.
UM, AND, AND BASICALLY SAYS IF THEY DON'T, UH, GET THE AIR CONDITIONING REPAIRED, I BELIEVE IT'S WITHIN, UH, FIVE DAYS THAT THEY WILL, THEY HAVE TO REPAIR OR REPLACE IT WITHIN FIVE DAYS OR PROVIDE THE RENTER AND AIR CONDITIONING UNIT OR ANOTHER PLACE TO STAY UNTIL REPAIRS ARE MADE.
AND, AND YOU'VE GOT THE, UH, DRAFT ORDINANCE THAT MR. ENGLAND, UM, SENT OUT EARLIER IN FRONT OF YOU.
WE'RE GONNA, WE'RE GONNA GO OVER IT AGAIN HERE IN JUST A MOMENT AND MAKE SURE THAT IT SAYS WHAT WE WOULD LIKE TO SAY NOW HERE IS, UH, BRINGING TO YOUR ATTENTION THIS, THE, THE BILL THAT'S IN COMMITTEE, UM, RIGHT NOW AT THE STATE LEVEL.
AND IT MAY OR MAY NOT PASS, SO, BUT WE GENERALLY TRY TO WATCH THE HANDWRITING ON THE WALL AND NOT DO THINGS THAT THE STATE WILL COME IN AND STEP ON US OVER.
SO THIS IS THE, THE BIG OUTLINES OF THIS BILL ARE VERY CLOSE TO WHAT WE HAVE ALREADY DISCUSSED.
UM, THE LANGUAGE IS A LITTLE, UM, PROBABLY A, A LITTLE LOOSER, WHICH PROBABLY MAKES IT MORE DIFFICULT TO, UM, TO ENFORCE.
BUT I WANTED TO ASK MR. ENGLAND TO TAKE US OVER THE, THE LA LATEST DRAFT AND GO DOWN IT WITH US.
AND AT VARIOUS POINTS ALONG THE WAY, I WANNA STOP YOU AND JUST QUESTION COMMITTEE BEFORE WE TRY TO FINALIZE SOME OF THIS AND MAKE SURE IF WE, IF WE WANT TO GO CLOSER TO WHAT THE STATE IS PROPOSING OR IF WE WANT TO MOVE AHEAD WITH WHERE WE ARE.
SO IF YOU WOULDN'T MIND TAKING THE LATEST DRAFT AND JUST KIND OF GOING DOWN IT WITH US, PLEASE.
WELL, MOST OF THE, YOU'LL SEE MOST OF THIS DRAFT.
IN FACT, 98% OF IT IS WHAT Y'ALL SAW LAST TIME IN FRONT OF YOU.
UM, IF YOU START ON PAGE TWO, THAT'S WHERE THE SUBSTANTIVE PROVISIONS ARE CONCERNING THE AIR CONDITION.
AND, UM, SUBSECTION FIVE A OF COURSE JUST SAYS THAT, UM, REFRIGERATOR, AIR EQUIPMENT HAS TO BE PROVIDED FOR DWELLING UNITS WITHIN, OR A LAUNDRY ROOM THAT IS OCCUPIED BY, OR RENTED OR LEASE TO A, UM, PARTY OTHER THAN THE OWNER.
AND THEY HAVE TO MAINTAIN THAT AIR CONDITION.
UM, UM, BETWEEN MAY ONE THROUGH OCTOBER 1ST, THAT'S THE, THAT'S THE PERIOD IN WHICH THE OPERATIVE PERIOD AND, UH, THE TEMPERATURE ZONE SHALL NOT EXCEED A MAXIMUM OF 85 DEGREES FARING HEIGHT.
UM, AND THEN SUBSECTION B UH, TALKS ABOUT THE, WHAT HAPPENS WHEN IT GETS ABOVE 105 DEGREES.
AND IN THAT CASE, THE INDOOR AMBIENT TEMPERATURE HAS TO BE MAINTAINED NO LESS THAN 20 DEGREES BELOW THE OUTDOOR AMBIENT TEMPERATURE.
AND THAT MATCHES UP WITH THE 85 DEGREES, UM, IN SUBSECTION A.
THEN WHAT HAPPENS WHEN THE AIR EQUIPMENT BECOMES INOPERABLE FOR A TIME GREATER THAN 72 HOURS? SUBSECTION C ADDRESSES THAT AND, UM, UM, WHEN IT DOESN'T MEET THE MINIMUM STANDARDS IN THE PREVIOUS TWO PROVI, UM, SECTIONS, AND IT SAYS THAT, UM, THEY HAVE TO PROVIDE AT LEAST ONE IN AT LEAST ONE HANDLE LIVING AREA OR BEDROOM, A UNIT THAT'S CAPABLE OF MEETING THE MINIMUM STANDARDS AS PREVIOUSLY DESCRIBED.
AND THAT MEANS THAT THEY DON'T HAVE TO KEEP THE WHOLE APARTMENT REFRIGERATED, WHICH WILL GREATLY ASSIST THE, UM, MULTI-FAMILY COMMUNITY,
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THE PROPERTY OWNERS AND THE PROPERTY MANAGERS.IT JUST MEANS THAT THEY HAVE TO KEEP ONE HABITABLE AREA, WHETHER THAT'S LIVING OR A BEDROOM.
AND THEN, OF COURSE, KEEP IN MIND ALSO IN SUBSECTION TWO OF, OF SEA THERE, THAT IF THEY CHOOSE, IF A TENANT WANTS TO BRING IN IN ANOTHER AIR CONDITIONING UNIT ON THEIR OWN FOR OTHER BEDROOMS OR FOR ANOTHER LIVING AREA, THEN THEY HAVE A RIGHT TO DO THAT BECAUSE THEY'RE THE PROPERTY MANAGER AND THE PROPERTY OWNERS ARE REQUIRED TO SUSPEND ANY RULES THAT, THAT DO NOT ALLOW THEM.
AND SO THERE'S ALWAYS THAT OPTION TO BRING IN THEIR OWN AIR UNITS IF THAT'S WHAT THEY WANT TO DO.
AND THAT WOULD BE AT THEIR OWN EXPENSE EXPENSE? THAT'S RIGHT.
NOT AT THE PROPERTY OWNER'S EXPENSE BECAUSE THEY CAN GET A CADILLAC OF A AIR CONDITIONER AND BRING THE RECEIPT.
AND THEN, UM, IF IT GOES FIVE DAYS AND THEY STILL HAVE NOT BEEN ABLE TO FIX THE, UM, FIX THE PROBLEM AND, UM, THERE ARE NO REFRIGERATOR UNITS AVAILABLE THAT'S REQUIRED BY SUBSECTION C ONE, THEN THEY HAVE TO, UH, MAKE PROVISIONS FOR OTHER ACCOMMODATIONS IN A MOTEL AT THE, UM, EXPENSE OF THE, UM, PROPERTY OWNER.
AND THAT'S KIND OF THE NUCLEAR OPTION, THE LAST RESORT.
AND SO, UM, THE COMMITTEE LAST TIME ASKED TO EXTEND THAT OUT TO FIVE DAYS.
AND SO THAT, THAT'S REALLY THE ONLY CHANGE THAT'S DIFFERENT FROM WHAT Y'ALL SAW BEFORE IN THIS.
AND THEN OF COURSE, WE ALSO ADDED AN EXCEPTION LAST TIME, WHICH I BELIEVE WAS PART OF THE LAST DRAFT.
WHAT HAPPENS WHEN THERE'S A POWER OUTAGE THAT'S NO FAULT OF THE, UM, UM, PROPERTY OWNER, WHETHER IT'S ENCORE OR JP N L, WHAT HAPPENS OR STATEWIDE EMERGENCY, UM, THEN THEY'RE NOT GONNA BE PENALIZED FOR THAT.
UM, IT WOULD, DOESN'T SEEM FAIR THAT IF THE HALF THE CITIES HAS NO POWER THAT WE PICK ON THE MULTI-FAMILY, UM, UM, MULTI-FAMILY COMMUNITY AND CHARGE THEM WITH CRIMINAL LIABILITY, UM, BECAUSE OF THAT.
BUT THAT'S, THAT'S THE BASICS OF THIS ORDINANCE.
AND, UM, I THINK, UM, THE CHAIR LADY, UM, UM, I THINK YOU HAVE IN FRONT OF YOU THE STATE AND YOU'LL SEE A LOT OF THE SAME PROVISIONS IN THERE, SOME DIFFERENT THINGS THAT THE STATE DOES, BUT YOU'LL SEE A LOT OF THE SAME PROVISIONS.
AND HERE, HERE IS ON, ON, ON COMMITTEE, I'LL JUST MAKE SURE YOU KNOW THIS, THE, THE NUCLEAR OPTION, WHICH IS REQUIREMENT AFTER FIVE DAYS, IF NO REPAIRS OR REPLACEMENTS HAVE BEEN MADE FOR THE HOTEL OWNER OR MANAGER TO PROVIDE AT THEIR EXPENSE HOTEL MOTEL TYPE FEES, UM, WITH NO CAP ON WHAT THOSE EXPENSES WOULD ENTAIL, UM, THIS IS, THIS IS INDEED A NUCLEAR OPTION.
AND I HAVE HEARD FROM A NUMBER, UH, THE, THE APARTMENT ASSOCIATION AND A NUMBER OF SMALL APARTMENT MANAGERS, UM, THAT THIS IS, IS SOMETHING THAT WOULD, UM, THEY JUST NOT GONNA BE ABLE TO ENDURE AND THEY'RE GONNA SHOW UP AND LOBBY HARD AGAINST IT CUZ WE WE'RE NOT CAPPING THEIR EXPOSURE.
AND I GET THAT HAVING OPERATED BUSINESS.
UM, SO, UM, SOME OF THE, THE STATE, DO YOU HAVE THE STATE BILL EASILY PULLED UP IN FRONT OF YOU? IT'S 20 25 92 HOUSE.
UM, THE, THE GENERAL GIST OF THE STATE IS ANOTHER PLACE TO STAY.
UM, AND I DON'T KNOW IF WE WANT TO CONSIDER, I MEAN, OBVIOUSLY IF THEY CAN MOVE THE TENANTS TO A DIFFERENT UNIT IN THE SAME COMPLEX OR MAYBE A, A DIFFERENT COMPLEX, ALTHOUGH THAT WOULD BE A PAIN, UM, THEN I WOULD THINK THAT THAT WOULD FULFILL THE SPIRIT OF GIVING THE TENANT A PLACE TO LIVE WITH AIR CONDITIONING.
UM, IF THEY MOVE THEM INTO A VACANT PLACE AND REQUIRE MOVING EXPENSES, IT GETS REALLY MESSY.
SO, UM, I HAD ASKED, UH, THE CITY ATTORNEY FOR, UH, IF THERE ARE OTHER WAYS OTHER THAN THE HOTEL REQUIREMENT THAT WE COULD ADD ADDITIONAL, UM, PRESSURE, UM, OR MAYBE HAVE THEM MAKE THEM ENTITLED TO A, A RENT REDUCTION OR REIMBURSEMENT.
AND SO, UM, IN BOTH AUSTIN AND HOUSTON, THEIR ORDINANCES, UH, STATE THAT IF THE LANDLORD FAILS TO MAINTAIN THE AIR CONDITIONING EQUIPMENT, THE TENANT MAY BE ENTITLED TO A RENT REDUCTION OR REIMBURSEMENT.
IT DOESN'T SPECIFICALLY STATE THAT THE LANDLORD MUST REIMBURSE A TENANT FOR RENT.
UM, AND THAT'S NOT REALLY ENFORCEABLE ON OUR END, BUT THAT'S, UM, I ASSUME THAT MAKES IT ENFORCEABLE BY THE TENANTS DIRECTLY THROUGH A CIVIL ACTION.
SO THAT REALLY DOESN'T HELP, THAT'S JUST SAYING THIS IS THE RIGHT THING THAT THEY OUGHT TO DO.
IT'S, IT'S, IT'S, IT WOULD BE VERY
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DIFFICULT FOR US TO ENFORCE IT WITHOUT ACCESS TO THOSE RECORDS.AND YOU'RE AT THAT POINT ALSO INTERFERING WITH THE THIRD PARTY CONTRACT THAT YOU'RE NOT A PARTY TOO.
SO IT'S JUST A DIFFICULT PROVISION TO ENFORCE.
AND I'M NOT SURE IT WOULD PROBABLY BE THE MOST EFFECTIVE WAY OF GOING ABOUT WHAT YOU'RE TRYING TO ACCOMPLISH.
UH, THE, THE SENATE OR THE TEXAS HOUSE BILL STATES THAT ALTERNATIVE HOUSING ACCOMMODATIONS MAINTAINED AT THE TEMPERATURE REQUIRED WOULD BE AFFORDED TO THE TENANTS.
SO I'M COMFORTABLE KEEPING IT THAT WAY.
UM, I THAT FIVE DAYS TO REPAIR AN AIR CONDITIONER OR TO GIVE THEM AN TEMPORARY OR RIGHT.
I, I THINK THAT THAT'S MORE THAN ENOUGH TIME, ESPECIALLY IF YOU'RE DEALING WITH PEOPLE WHO REALLY NEED THAT, THAT AMBIENT TEMPERATURE TO BE LOWER THAN 105 DEGREES.
SO WE, WE COULD ADD LANGUAGE, UM, UM, THAT SAYS MUST PROPO PROVIDE FOR HOTEL OR MOTEL ACCOMMODATIONS AND, UM, OR ALTERNATIVE, UM, TO, TO KIND OF TRACK WITH STATE LAW OR ALTERNATIVE, UM, SEE HOW THEY, HOW DID THEY SAY IT IN HERE? UH, ALTERNATIVE HOUSING ACCOMMODATION.
SO YOU COULD ADD AN ALTERNATIVE HOUSING ACCOMMODATION IN THERE, SO IT DOESN'T HAVE TO BE A HOTEL IF THEY HAVE ANOTHER.
SO IF A MANAGEMENT COMPANY IS IN CHARGE OF ANOTHER COMPLEX OR IF THE PROPERTY OWNER HAS ANOTHER APARTMENT, THEY CAN ALWAYS TRANSFER OVER THERE.
BUT THEY DON'T ACTUALLY SAY HOTEL MOTEL, THEY NO, THEY SAY ALTERNATIVE.
AND SEE, I WOULD RATHER JUST KEEP IT, ALTERNATIVE HOUSING COULD INCLUDE HOTEL MOTEL.
UM, AND I DO THINK THAT'S REASONABLE AND TRACKING WITH THE STATE LANGUAGE, SHOULD THEY PASS IT, IT WILL BE, UM, MORE REASONABLE FOR US JUST TO FIT IN UNDER WHAT THEY'RE DOING.
AND THAT STILL, THAT STILL SERVES OUR PURPOSE, SEEMS LIKE.
JUST HAVING ALTERNATIVE HOUSING IS THE SOLE.
ED, DO YOU HAVE THOUGHTS? WHAT GOOD WITH THAT? OKAY.
AND AGAIN, GOING OVER THIS ONE MORE TIME, I HOPE.
UM, OTHER THAN THAT, UH, COMMITTEE, DO YOU SEE ANYTHING ELSE IN HERE THAT, THAT LEAVES YOU UNCOMFORTABLE? WE HAVE, WE HAVE ADDRESSED A GREAT MANY OF THE APARTMENT MANAGERS AND OWNERS CONCERNS.
UM, WORST CASE SCENARIOS, THIS COULD BE, YOU KNOW, BUT THE WHOLE POINT IS IT'S A WORST CASE SCENARIO FOR THE TENANTS AND BETWEEN THE TENANTS AND THE LANDLORDS, THE LANDLORDS HAVE PROBABLY MORE OF AN ABILITY TO, UM, BE COMFORTABLE THAN THE TENANTS.
SO, UM, WITH THAT ONE CHANGE IN, IN LANGUAGE ON PAGE TWO, UH, D FIVE.
AND THEN THAT THEN TWO SHOULD BE THREE.
AND THEN I'LL CHA I'LL ADD IN THE ALTERNATIVE, ALTERNATIVE HOUSING ACCOMMODATION AND REMOVE FOUR HOTEL OR MOTEL ACCOMMODATIONS MM-HMM.
SO I'LL ADD THAT IN THERE AND IT SHOULD BE READY TO GO AT THAT POINT.
SO ANY, ANY LAST MINUTE CONCERNS? ANYTHING ELSE YOU WANNA ADD OR SUBTRACT TO THIS BEFORE WE REPORT IT OUT? OH, ARE WE REPORTING IT OUT WITH THOSE CHANGES? MM-HMM.
ALL IN FAVOR OF SENDING IT OUT.
AND AGAIN, WE, WE ARE LIKELY TO HAVE, UM, SOME PUSHBACK FROM THE APARTMENT ASSOCIATION, BUT WE HAVE INCORPORATED ALMOST ALL THE THINGS THAT THEY WERE CONCERNED ABOUT AND GOT THEM IN ALIGNMENT WITH BEST PRACTICES.
SO I'M PRETTY COMFORTABLE THAT WE HAVE, HAVE WORKED HARD TO GET THIS TO BE A WELL NUANCED, UM, ORDINANCE CHANGE THAT WILL ALSO BE MORE PROTECTIVE OF OUR TENANTS AND THE CITY.
THIS IS SOMETHING I CAN STAND BEHIND.
UH, MR. ENGLAND, WILL YOU TAKE US ON, UH, HOLD ON, LET ME FIND MY, UH, AGENDA.
LET'S MOVE ON TO AGENDA ITEM FOUR, DISCUSS PET STORE ORDINANCE.
BOTH THESE THINGS ARE EXPLOSIVE.
UM, DO YOU WANNA WALK US THROUGH THIS? SURE.
IT'S THE, THERE'S, THERE'S ONLY ONE SUBSTANTIVE CHANGE FROM THE LAST TIME THAT, THAT Y'ALL LOOKED AT THAT AND THAT, AND REALLY THERE'S TWO BLANKS THAT NEED TO BE FILLED IN ON, ON THE SECOND PAGE, BUT WE'LL GO THROUGH THE FIRST PAGE FIRST JUST FOR THE SAKE OF ANYBODY WHO MAY BE LISTENING.
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UM, BASICALLY THIS ORDINANCE PROHIBITS COMMERCIAL BUSINESSES, RETAIL BUSINESSES, AND SPECIFICALLY FROM, FROM SELLING, EXCHANGING, BARTERING, GIVING AWAY OR TRANSFERRING A DOG OR CAT REGARDLESS OF THE, THE DOG OR CAT'S AGE.AND, UM, UM, THE RETAIL PET STORE CAN PROVIDE A SPACE FOR DOGS AND CATS THAT HAVE BEEN, UM, HAVE BEEN PUT ON, I HATE TO SAY CONSIGNMENT, BUT IT KIND OF IS, YOU KNOW, THEY'VE, THEY'VE LET 'EM BORROW IT FOR DISPLAY SO THAT SOMEBODY CAN COME ADOPT THE DOG OR CAT.
UM, BUT IF THEY, IF THEY HAVE THAT, THEY HAVE CERTAIN REQUIREMENTS UNDER THIS ORDINANCE THAT WOULD, UM, REQUIRE THEM TO POST ON THE ENCLOSURE OF EACH DOG OR CAT OFFERED FOR ADOPTION, THE NAME AND ADDRESS AND CONTACT INFORMATION OF THE SHELTER FROM WHICH THE DOG OR CAT CAME.
AND, UM, THAT'S A WAY OF COURSE, OF JUST MAKING SURE THAT THEY'RE, THEY'RE COMING FROM, UM, UH, REPUTABLE, UH, UM, BREEDERS AND, UM, OR SHELTERS MM-HMM.
AND, UM, THEY'RE NOT COMING FROM, UM, OF COURSE THE, THE, THE BREEDERS THAT WE'RE TRYING TO CUT OUT OF THIS EQUATION, THE RETAIL PET STORE MUST RETAIN AT FOUR, AT LEAST THREE YEARS AFTER THE ADOPTION OF THE DOG OR CAT DOCUMENTATION STATING WHERE IT CAME FROM.
IT ALLOWS, IT ALLOWS AT THAT POINT, THE CITY TO COME IN AND DO AN AUDIT.
AND IT'S RETAIL, PET STORE, RETAIL, PET STORE ONLY.
WELL, YES, UH, THE SOAR IS ALSO IMPORTANT TO CATCH, BUT SO MIGHT BE MORE IMPORTANT
UM, AND THEN OF COURSE NUMBER TWO IS THE DATES.
AND THIS IS THE ONE THAT WE TALKED ABOUT LAST TIME, ABOUT WHEN DID WE MAKE THIS EFFECTIVE.
THERE'S A COUPLE OF WAYS WE COULD DO THIS.
WE COULD MAKE THE ORDINANCE NOT EFFECTIVE FOR SIX MONTHS, OR WE COULD JUST MAKE THE ORDINANCE EFFECTIVE ON ITS PASSAGE.
LIKE WE DO ALMOST ALL ORDINANCE, BUT ALLOW FOR THE FACT THAT THERE MAY BE A LEASE OUT THERE OR THERE MAY BE DOGS OR CATS THAT ARE PART OF THEIR, THEIR, UM, INVENTORY THAT THEY NEED TO SELL.
AND SO WHAT I STARTED, WHEN I STARTED LOOKING AT ALL THE OTHER ORDINANCES AROUND THE STATE, UM, A YEAR SEEMS SOME WERE SIX MONTHS, SOME WERE A YEAR.
AND SO A YEAR WOULD BE PLENTY ENOUGH TO SATISFY ME THAT WE WOULDN'T BE INTERFERING WITH CONTRACTS THAT HAVE ALREADY BEEN ENTERED INTO.
AND SO BASICALLY IT SAYS THAT IF YOU ARE SELLING IT AS A RETAIL, RETAIL PET STORE, SO WE HAVE TWO, THE TWO THAT CURRENTLY DO IT, THEY HAVE UNTIL APRIL OF 2024.
UM, ASSUMING THAT Y'ALL PASS THIS, THIS APRIL A YEAR FROM THE PASSAGE BASICALLY, UM, TO, TO SELL THEIR INVENTORY AND STOP SELLING, THAT'S BASICALLY WHAT THAT MEANS.
WOULD THEY BE ABLE TO GET NEW INVENTORY? YES, THEY WOULD DURING THE YEAR.
THEY BASICALLY, THEY GO FROM, YEAH, THEY BASICALLY GET A YEAR TO CONTINUE THEIR BUSINESS AS IT IT IS.
AND THAT'S MORE ABOUT THE LEASE, THE POSSIBILITY OF A LEASE THAN IT IS THE POSSIBILITY OF HAVING CATS AND DOGS THAT THEY CAN'T GET RID OF, THAT THEY NEED TO GET RID OF.
CAN WE PUT LANGUAGE IN THERE TO SAY NO NEW INVENTORY OR AGAIN, YOU'RE THEN YOU'RE NOT, YOU'RE NOT DEALING WITH THE SITUATION OF A LEASE OF AN, OF A LEASE.
IT'S ALREADY BEEN ENTERING TOO.
AND THEY'RE, AND FOR ONE OF 'EM, I'M NOT CONCERNED, AND I CAN'T REMEMBER WHICH ONE, BUT ONE OF 'EM SELLS BOTH CATS AND DOGS AND DOGS AND CAT SUPPLIES, PET SUPPLIES, THAT'S, IT'S THE OTHER ONE THAT I'M CONCERNED ABOUT.
I DON'T KNOW WHAT THEIR LEASE LOOKS LIKE, AND QUITE FRANKLY, THEY DON'T HAVE TO TELL US.
UM, THAT, THAT'D BE THE ONE THAT I'D BE CONCERNED ABOUT IS INTERFERING WITH THEIR LEASE.
UM, AGAIN, THIS IS, THIS IS SOMETHING WHERE WE'RE, UH, CHANGING THE RULES MIDSTREAM.
AND THAT'S IN GENERAL SOMETHING I'M ALWAYS OPPOSED TO, UH, WHEN YOU'RE DEALING WITH BUSINESSES, BUT WE'RE HAVING TO BALANCE A WELFARE OF ANIMALS THAT, YOU KNOW, NATIONWIDE HAVE BEEN SHOWN TO BE NOT TREATED WELL, WHETHER THESE PARTICULAR STORES SAY THAT OR NOT, UM, BY THE BREEDERS.
SO I AM COMFORTABLE WITH A YEAR, AND AT THE END OF THE YEAR WE'LL BE DONE.
WE'VE ALREADY TIGHTENED IT UP.
SO DURING THIS YEAR, THEY'RE GONNA BE HAVING MULTIPLE INSPECTIONS MM-HMM.
AND IF THEY DON'T MEET THOSE CRITERIA, IF THEY STUMBLE A FEW TIMES, THEY'RE GONNA CLOSE EARLIER ANYWAY.
SO WE'LL WATCH 'EM CAREFULLY, THEY'LL BE INSPECTED AND AT THE END OF THE YEAR WE'LL BE DONE AND OUT OF THE PET RETAIL PET BUSINESS.
SO, UM, THE ONE, AND I KNOW I ALREADY MENTIONED THIS BEFORE, UM, PAGE ONE WHERE IT SAYS THE PET STORE DOES NOT RECEIVE ANY FEES OR COMPENSATION ASSOCIATED WITH A DISPLAY OF THE DOGS OR CATS.
HERE'S THE THING, I UNDERSTAND THEM NOT GETTING A COMMISSION ON THE SALE OF DOGS AND CATS, BUT ASSOCIATED WITH THE DISPLAY.
I MEAN, COULD WE NOT, COULD THE SHELTER NOT,
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UH, DECIDE ON THEIR OWN VOLITION THAT THEY WANT TO PAY FOR THE DISPLAY OF ANIMALS AND, AND MAKE THAT ARRANGEMENT? BECAUSE THIS SAYS THEY COULDN'T, EVEN IF THE SHELTER WANTED TO DO THAT, THEY COULDN'T RENT WINDOWS SPACE TO PUT THE DOGGIES IN THE WINDOWS.I WOULD RATHER NOT COMPLETELY.
IS THERE SOME WAY TO NOT SHUT THAT DOOR? I THINK, I THINK BASED ON LAST TIME Y'ALL HAD HEARD FROM, UM, ART, THAT THAT'S REALLY NOT WHAT'S HAPPENING.
SHELTERS WON'T TAKE ADVANTAGE OF A, A SITUATION LIKE THIS TO DISPLAY CATS AND DOGS.
THAT'S NOT REALLY IN PRACTICE WHAT HAPPENS.
AND SO, UM, YEAH, Y'ALL COULD, YOU'RE RIGHT, Y'ALL COULD MAKE IT TO WHERE THAT THEY WANTED TO DISPLAY IT, BUT IT KIND OF REMOVED THAT PROVISION AT THAT POINT.
AND AT THAT POINT WE'RE BACK INTO THE GAME OF TRACKING THE DOGS AND THE CATS TO MAKE SURE WHERE THEY'RE COMING FROM.
AND, UM, AND SO IT'S, IT'S, IT'S A LITTLE LOOSER THAT WAY, BUT WE COULD DO THAT IF THAT'S WHAT THE COMMITTEE WANTS TO DO.
EXPLAIN FURTHER AGAIN, YOUR YOUR POINT, UH, MADAM CHAIR.
UM, I WAS JUST THINKING, WE HAVE A STORE AND IT SAYS THEY CAN'T GET PAID OR COMPENSATED FOR BASICALLY FOR DISPLAYING THE DOGS AND CATS AT THEIR STORE, LIKE PUTTING THEM IN, IN FRONT OF THEIR, SO THAT THEIR CUSTOMERS COMING IN COULD POTENTIALLY BUY A SHELTER DOG.
AND SO THEY CAN'T, UH, THEY CAN'T OWN ANY OF THE DOGS.
THEY CAN'T ADOPT THEM FROM THE SHELTER AND THEN SELL THEM.
BUT I WAS JUST WONDERING, YOU KNOW, IS IT POSSIBLE THAT THE SHELTER, ESPECIALLY WHEN IT'S OVERCROWDED, WOULD THEY BE INTERESTED IN, UM, BASICALLY RENTING THE DISPLAY TO SAY, I'D LIKE TO, TO SEE THEM DISPLAYED THERE COULD, IF IT WAS A BUSINESS, THEN IT MIGHT INCENTIVIZE THE BUSINESS TO HAVE A DISPLAY DOGS, RIGHT? YEAH.
OR I MEAN, CUZ OTHERWISE THEY WOULDN'T, WHY WOULD THEY, THEY HAVE TO TAKE CARE OF THEM.
THEY HAVE TO CLEAN UP THEIR POOP AND FEED 'EM AND THEY'RE RESPONSIBLE FOR THEM, BUT THERE'S NO UPSIDE FOR THEM.
SO WHY WOULD THEY, SO IF, IF THEY WERE ALLOWED TO, TO RENT TO THE SHELTER, UM, OR TO RESCUES, I GUESS WE, WE WOULDN'T, UM, YOU'RE INCENTIVIZING, I GUESS MISCHIEF ALSO, THAT'S THE THING.
YOU'RE INCENTIVIZING MISCHIEF AND THAT IS A STORE COMING UP WITH A NON-PROFIT SHELTER THAT THAT'S EITHER LOOSELY ASSOCIATED WITH THEM OR THEY KNOW THE OWNERS AND THEN AH, GOTCHA.
YOU'RE, YOU'RE INCENTIVIZING THIS IDEA OF WHAT A WALK AROUND.
THAT'S THE, THAT'S THE ONLY, THAT WOULD BE THE ONLY RISK INVOLVED WITH THAT.
AND, AND I DON'T KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT IT.
UM, BUT, UM, ANIMAL CONTROL CAN CERTAINLY CORRECT ME ON THIS AS FAR AS, AS FAR AS WOULD THIS EVEN PRACTICALLY HAPPEN BETWEEN SHELTERS AND RESCUES? BECAUSE BASED ON MY CONVERSATIONS THEY SAY THAT THAT WOULDN'T, THEY WOULDN'T DO THAT.
THEY'RE NOT GONNA PAY AN A SHELTER'S NOT GONNA PAY A NONPROFIT, SHELTER'S NOT GONNA PAY A THIRD PARTY FEE TO STORE ANIMALS TO SELL.
OR TO HAND OUT FOR ADOPTION, BUT I COULD BE.
UM, BUT YOU, WELL, AND THE VAST MAJORITY OF OUR SHELTER DOGS END UP BEING PITS AND PIT BLENDS.
AND THEY DON'T LOOK SO CUTE IN A WINDOW OF A RETAIL PET STORE.
WELL, MAY WE ASK, UM, STAFF IF SURE.
THEY'RE THE EXPERTS ON THIS WOULD BE AN OPTION.
WOULD YOU PAY TO HAVE, UM, ANIMALS DISPLAYED AT A SHOP? SO IT'S GET YOU ON MY, SO BASICALLY, UH, WITH THE TWO PET SHOPS THAT WE HAVE, I DON'T NECESSARILY THINK THAT THE TWO PET SHOPS ARE, THOSE ARE THE GENERALLY HAVE DESIGNER BREEDS.
AND SO MOST OF THE DOGS WE HAVE ON DISPLAY HERE AT OUR SHELTER AREN'T EXACTLY WHAT THEY'RE LOOKING FOR TO DISPLAY MM-HMM.
BUT IF IT WERE AN OPTION FOR THEM AND YOU WERE A, YOU WERE ABLE TO, YOU KNOW, RELIEVE THE SHELTER OF, OF, OF A NUMBER OF ANIMALS TO DO SO, WOULD, WOULD YOU ALL PAY FOR THAT PRIVILEGE TO DO IT? SURE.
IF IF THAT'S SOMETHING THEY'RE INTERESTED IN AND THAT THE COMMITTEE WOULD LIKE TO SEE, WE, WE COULD DEFINITELY EXPLORE THAT OPTION FOR SURE.
AND YOU KNOW, I'M THINKING TOO, THE, THE ONE, THE ONE STORE ONLY HAS A HANDFUL OF, UM, P PUPPY DREAM WHATEVER, I FORGET THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN SUIT.
SO, AND THEY'RE NOT GONNA BE ABLE TO CONTINUE WITH, AS THIS GOES ON, THEY'RE NOT GONNA BE ABLE TO CONTINUE TO SELL DESIGNER BREEDS CUZ WE'RE SHUTTING THAT DOWN.
SO RATHER THAN CLOSING THEIR STORE, IF
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I'M JUST THINKING SPONSORS, WOULD WE HAVE SPONSORS WHO WANNA SAY 50 DOGS FROM THE SHELTER AND WE COULD NOT HAVE IT BE RESCUE GROUPS? YEAH, THAT'S WHAT I WAS GONNA SAY.JUST BECAUSE THEY CAN CREATE A RESCUE GROUP, RESCUE GROUP THAT'S REALLY A PUPPY MILL.
BUT IF WE SAY ONLY FROM LICENSED SHELTER AND WE COULD, WE COULD SAY GARLAND OR WE COULD HOW, OR, OR LICENSED MUNICIPAL PET SHELTER, WHATEVER.
I DON'T KNOW HOW WE'D DEFINE THAT.
BUT, UM, AND DOGS COULD BE SPONSORED POSSIBLY THE DISPLAY FEE TO GO INTO THOSE STORES TO, I MEAN WE DO ALREADY DO THIS WITH SOMETIMES WITH THESE OUT OF THE SHELTER.
I THINK THAT WOULD BE THE, DEFINITELY THE WAY TO DO IT WITH MUNICIPAL SHELTERS ONLY.
ONLY ONLY AND THE GARLAND SHELTER IN SPECIFIC.
WE COULD, WE COULD PROBABLY DEFINITELY FACILITATE THAT SPACE.
SO IF YOU LOOK AT IT NATIONWIDE AND YOU LOOK AT THE BUSINESSES THAT WE'RE TRYING TO GET RID OF THE BUY FROM PUPPY MILLS, THOSE DOGS ARE SOLD FOR $5,000 IN THESE.
I MEAN, THE BUSINESS IS NOT GONNA BE INTERESTED IN IT CUZ THEIR BOTTOM LINE JUST WILL NOT SURVIVE IT.
UM, I WORK WITH A LOT OF RESCUES OUTSIDE OF ANIMAL SERVICES AS WELL.
SO THE DISPLAY ANIMALS WE TALK ABOUT GENERALLY ARE A RESCUE THAT GETS 'EM, FOSTERS 'EM, TAKES 'EM FROM THE SHELTERS, PETSMART, THINGS LIKE THAT.
SO THE BOOTH INSIDE THERE IS SET UP BY PETSMART, BUT IT'S NOT RAN BY PETSMART, THE VOLUNTEERS FOR THAT ORGANIZATION.
SO ALL THOSE THINGS THAT YOU THINK OF AS CARE THAT THE BUSINESS HAS TO PROVIDE MM-HMM.
IT'S THE RESCUE PROVIDES THOSE.
I ACTUALLY DO IT FOR FROGS IN, IN OUR, WITH ALL THE CATS THERE.
WE DO THE LAUNDRY, WE FEED, WE WATER.
SO ALL THEY PROVIDE IS A BOOTH FOR THOSE ANIMALS TO BE IN MM-HMM.
IN FACT, THEY DON'T EVEN HANDLE THE ADOPTIONS OR ANYTHING.
ALL THAT'S DONE THROUGH THE ORGANIZATION THAT'S DISPLAYING THE PETS.
THEY JUST ALLOW THOSE PETS TO BE THERE.
IT'S A DRAW TO THE STORE BECAUSE THEY DO HAVE THE LIVE ANIMALS THAT ARE AVAILABLE FOR ADOPTION THAT EVERYBODY WANTS MM-HMM.
AND THANK YOU FOR WHAT YOU DO OFF DUTY, BY THE WAY, APPRECIATE YOUR VOLUNTEER EFFORTS AND YOUR HEART IN THAT.
SO OPINIONS BETWEEN THE TWO OF YOU, IF WE WERE TO DO THIS AND YOU KNOW, THEY, THE, THE ONE WITH THE 50 DOGS MAY JUST CLOSE THEIR TENT AND GO AWAY.
UM, AND, AND IF THAT'S THEIR CHOICE, THAT'S THEIR CHOICE.
BUT, AND YEAH, THEY WOULDN'T BE GETTING ANY $5,000 DOGS AND WE WOULDN'T BE HAVING TO EVEN THINK ABOUT THE, UH, PREDATORY PET LOANS WHERE THEY BASICALLY LEASE THE DOGS OUT AND THREATEN TO TAKE 'EM BACK IF PEOPLE FALL BEHIND.
SO THAT WOULD SOLVE A WHOLE BUNCH OF PROBLEMS. UM, FOR A LOT OF GARLAND PEOPLE.
UM, I THINK COMING IN AND GETTING A MUCH MORE REASONABLY PRICED PET FOR THEIR HOME WOULD BE A, A GOOD THING.
SO FOR THE SMALLER SHOP, I THINK THEY WOULD STILL THRIVE.
UM, THE, THE ONE THAT ONLY HAS A HANDFUL OF PETS, AND THEY MIGHT STILL DO FINE WITH THIS.
THE BIG, BIG ONE, I'M, I'M THINKING MAYBE NOT, UM, EVEN THE SMALL ONE IS RELOCATED TO GARLAND BECAUSE OF THE LAWS IN HOUSTON.
HAVE YOU HEARD THAT SPECIFICALLY? YEAH, I'VE BEEN, I DO THE, THE ACTUAL INSPECTIONS AT THE SHOP.
SO I'M THE GUY THAT GOES THERE.
SO THE REASON THEY RELOCATED IS SIMPLY HOUSTON MADE IT VERY DIFFICULT FOR THEM TO SELL.
AND THE SAME THING HAPPENED TO US, UNFORTUNATELY WITH THE OTHER BUSINESS.
DALLAS WAS A LITTLE FASTER AND THE BUSINESS CAME HERE INSTEAD OF DALLAS.
THAT'S BASICALLY WITH THE TWO THAT WE HAVE, THOSE ARE THE BOATS THAT WE'RE IN WITH BOTH OF 'EM, SO, OKAY.
THEY HAVEN'T BEEN HERE YEARS AND YEARS.
WELL, THE ONE'S BEEN HERE QUITE A WHILE, BUT THEY RAN ONE IN HOUSTON AND RAN ONE HERE.
UM, BUT IT'S STILL KIND OF DESIGNER DOGS.
THEY HAVE BEEN IN THE CITY FOR A WHILE.
UM, THEY DON'T DO A TON OF BUSINESS, BUT STILL WHERE THEY GET THEIR DOGS IS VERY MM-HMM.
BUT THE OTHER BUSINESS, DALLAS PUT THEIR ORDINANCE IN PLACE AND THEY DECIDE TO COME HERE.
SO I HATE REUSING A A A PHRASE THAT'S BEEN OVERUSED IN THE LAST TWO DAYS IN THE NEWS, BUT YOU KNOW, IS, IS THE JEWS WORTH THE SQUEEZE ON THIS ONE TO TRY TO, TO LEAVE, UH, SOMETHING IN HERE, NAIL IT DOWN ONLY TO THEY
[00:30:01]
COULD, LEAVING THEM FREE TO TAKE FEES, DISPLAY FEES FROM A MU YOU KNOW, AN OFFICIAL MUNICIPAL SHELTER OR THE GARLAND ANIMAL SHELTER.UM, I'M HAVING SERIOUS DOUBTS THAT THAT'S GONNA BE USED IN THESE TWO.
SO I CAN TELL YOU IN OUR BUDGET, IT'S NOT THERE.
I MEAN WE WE'RE TRYING HARD TO GET THE EXTRA MONEY TO RUN THE BIGGER SHELTER ANYWAY, RIGHT? MM-HMM.
AND WHEN WE ALREADY HAVE GROUPS AND ORGANIZATIONS LIKE FROGS AND YOUR LOCAL ISSUES, RIGHT? THEY'RE WILLING TO TAKE UP AND TAKE THAT BURDEN AND TAKE CARE OF THE ANIMALS AND GET 'EM OUT THERE.
THE PROBABILITY OF US IS MUNICIPAL SHELTER PUTTING THAT IN OUR BUDGET.
IT'S JUST, AND I WAS THINKING ABOUT MORE APPEALING TO THE PUBLIC, BUT IS THAT WORTH, IS IT WORTH THE COMPLEXITY OF DOING THAT FOR THIS? AND I'M THINKING NO, I AGREE.
UM, SO WITH THE, UH, WITH MAKING THIS EFFECTIVE ONE YEAR FROM, UM, BEING PASSED, DID SOMEBODY JUST PUNCH IN? NO, THAT WAS ME.
DO YOU NEED TO SAY SOMETHING? NOPE.
KATE'S AND NOT INSTEAD OF CATS, SO OH,
WE SHOULD, MAYBE WE SHOULD PROOF THE REST OF THIS KIND OF MORE CAREFULLY.
SO THE FINAL VERSION WILL BE PROOF.
SO Y'ALL KNOW SHE DOESN'T MISS THESE THINGS.
THE ONLY THING THAT WE, IN SUMMARY, THE ONLY THING WE'VE DONE HERE IS CHANGE, UH, IS IDENTIFIED THE DATES, RIGHT? YES.
AND JUST AGAIN, THIS IS, THIS IS ONE OF, THIS IS ANOTHER NUCLEAR OPTION AND JUST WANTED TO MAKE REALLY SURE WE'RE ALL COMFORTABLE WITH IT BECAUSE WE'RE GONNA BRING IT TO COUNCIL AND WE'VE HAD A LONG PROCESS OF, UM, THINKING THIS THROUGH AND CONSIDERING IT.
AND, UM, WE'RE GONNA HAVE TO WALK COUNSEL THROUGH THAT SAME PROCESS.
SO ARE WE GOOD TO TAKE THIS OUT? ABSOLUTELY.
AND THAT BRINGS US TO ITEM FIVE, WHICH IS AN ADJOURNMENT.
SO IS SOMEBODY ELSE PUNCHING IN? NO.
SO AT 4:32 PM WE ARE ADJOURNED.