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[00:00:07]

WELL. GOOD EVENING. WELCOME TO A SPECIAL CALL COMBINED MEETING OF THE GARLAND CITY COUNCIL AND PLANNING COMMISSION. WE'RE GOING TO GO AHEAD AND GET RIGHT INTO OUR MEETING THIS EVENING, STARTING WITH ITEM NUMBER ONE. PUBLIC COMMENTS. DO WE HAVE ANY PUBLIC COMMENTS THIS EVENING?

[a. Garland Forward Community Presentation and Joint Workshop with City Council and Plan Commission – Land Use Fiscal Analysis Overview]

NO, SIR, WE DO NOT. THANK YOU. ITEM NUMBER TWO FOR INDIVIDUAL CONSIDERATION TO A. GARLAND FORWARD COMMUNITY PRESENTATION AND JOINT WORKSHOP WITH THE CITY COUNCIL AND PLANNING COMMISSION.

LAND USE FISCAL ANALYSIS OVERVIEW. AND FOR THAT PRESENTATION THIS EVENING, WE'RE GOING TO TURN OUR MEETING OVER TO KEVIN SHEPHERD, VIRGINITY CONSULTANTS. KEVIN. YOU READY? YES, SIR. GOOD EVENING. COUNCIL. GOOD TO SEE Y'ALL. AGAIN, I THINK THE LAST TIME WE SAW EACH OTHER, WE WERE ON A ON A BUS OR A VAN. SO OUR PREVIOUS COMMUNITY PRESENTATION TALKED ABOUT THE DEVELOPMENT PATTERN IN CITIES AND THE CONNECTION BETWEEN HOW AND WHERE AND HOW FAST OUR CITIES DEVELOP AND THE, THE ECONOMICS OF A CITY. AND DURING OR AT THE END OF THAT PRESENTATION, WE PROMISED TO COME BACK AND GIVE AN OVERVIEW TO THE COMMUNITY AND TO YOU ALL COUNCIL AND PLANNING COMMISSION. OF THE RESULTS OF THE ANALYSIS OF GARLAND. AND THAT'S WHAT TONIGHT IS ABOUT. I WILL TELL YOU THAT THAT BEHIND THIS PRESENTATION IS ABOUT, I DON'T KNOW, 180 SLIDES OF ALL KINDS OF MORE DETAILED STUFF THAT THAT STAFF HAVE SEEN AND WE'RE GOING TO BE DIVING INTO. BUT THIS IS JUST INTENDED TO GIVE YOU ALL AN OVERVIEW AND ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS THAT THAT YOU ALL HAVE HAVE TONIGHT. SO PRESUMING GARLAND HAS A RESOURCE GAP, WHICH YOU DO AND WE'LL TELL YOU WHAT THAT WHAT THAT IS HERE IN A LITTLE BIT. THE OPTIONS THAT YOU HAVE TO CLOSE THAT GAP. AND WHAT I MEAN BY RESOURCE GAP IS THE REVENUE OR THE COSTS OR THE REVENUE THAT THE CITY NEEDS TO PAY FOR BASIC SERVICES AND INFRASTRUCTURE, NOT JUST NOW, BUT BUT OVER TIME. IF YOU DO HAVE THAT RESOURCE GAP, WHAT ARE THE WAYS TO CLOSE IT? IN VERY GENERAL TERMS, YOU CAN INCREASE REVENUE BY INCREASING IT, INCREASING TAXES. NOT A POPULAR OPTION. YOU CAN CUT SERVICES TO ALIGN WITH THE REVENUES THAT THAT YOU HAVE. ALSO NOT A VERY POPULAR OPTION. OR YOU CAN DEVELOP IN A DIFFERENT WAY OR A MORE PRODUCTIVE WAY THAT ALIGNS YOUR DEVELOPMENT PATTERN, YOUR SERVICE MODEL, YOUR FINANCIAL STRUCTURE WITH WHAT YOUR RESIDENTS ARE WILLING AND ABLE TO PAY FOR OVER TIME. THAT'S OUR GOAL. ONE OF THE MAIN CHARGES THAT WE WERE GIVEN WHEN WE STARTED THIS COMPREHENSIVE PLAN IS LOOK AT HOW CAN WE GUIDE REDEVELOPMENT IN GARLAND TO CLOSE THAT GAP OR TO ALIGN THE DEVELOPMENT PATTERN AND COSTS A LITTLE BIT BETTER? AN EXAMPLE OF THE KIND OF ANALYSIS THAT YOU'LL SEE LATER ON IN THE PROJECT WILL DO THIS FOR CERTAIN PROPERTIES OR OR AREAS INSIDE GARLAND. BUT THIS IS JUST TO THESE NUMBERS AREN'T SPECIFIC TO GARLAND AT THIS POINT, BUT IT'S JUST AN EXAMPLE OF WHAT YOU GUYS, WHAT I WANT YOU GUYS TO SEE TONIGHT. THIS IS AN EXAMPLE OF JUST SINGLE FAMILY SUBURBAN DESIGN WHERE YOU HAVE ALL SINGLE FAMILY DETACHED HOMES. NO OTHER KINDS OF HOMES MIXED IN THERE. YOU'VE GOT AN AVERAGE AN AVERAGE HOME VALUE ON THIS TYPE OF DEVELOPMENT OF 325,000 AND A LITTLE UNDER FIVE ACRES OF GREEN SPACE. NOTHING COMMERCIAL. ON THIS. AND WHEN YOU LOOK AT REVENUES AND NET COSTS OR REVENUES, COSTS AND NET REVENUE, THIS DEVELOPMENT PATTERN ACTUALLY NETS OUT A LITTLE BIT ON THE NEGATIVE SIDE FOR THE CITY. IF YOU CONTRAST THAT WITH A MORE TRADITIONAL MIXED USE DESIGN WHERE YOU HAVE A MIX OF DIFFERENT HOUSING PRODUCTS, DIFFERENT VALUES. YOU ACTUALLY CAPTURE MORE TAXABLE VALUE BY MIXING THE LOT SIZES AND THE PRODUCTS. YOU GET A LOT MORE DIVERSITY IN THE DIFFERENT PRICE POINTS OF PRODUCTS, WHETHER THAT'S THROUGH THE SIZE, THROUGH THE QUALITY OF THE DESIGN, THE SIZE OF THE STRUCTURE ITSELF, THE NUMBER OF UNITS. THERE'S A LOT OF DIFFERENT WAYS TO GET AT THAT. YOU GET A LITTLE BIT MORE GREEN SPACE. YOU GET SOME COMMERCIAL SPACE MIXED IN. AND BECAUSE OF THAT MIXTURE, YOU ACTUALLY NET OUT ON THE POSITIVE SIDE HERE. SO YOU'RE PROVIDING THE SPECTRUM OF HOUSING. YOU'RE INTEGRATING A LITTLE BIT OF COMMERCIAL CLOSER TO THE RESIDENTS. AT A SCALE THAT FITS THAT THAT NEIGHBORHOOD. AND YOUR NET POSITIVE. TWO KIND OF EXTREMES OF WHAT WE'LL BE LOOKING AT NEIGHBORHOOD BY NEIGHBORHOOD WITHIN GARLAND AS WE GO FORWARD. SOME DIFFERENT APPLICATIONS OF THIS LAND USE FISCAL ANALYSIS THAT THAT WE'VE DONE THAT WE'VE SEEN SOME OTHER CITIES USE IT FOR. MOST IMPORTANTLY, IT PROVIDES KIND OF THAT COMMON LANGUAGE FOR THE COMMUNITY TO TALK ABOUT EVERYTHING FROM LAND USE AND DENSITY. AND, YOU KNOW, AFFORDABLE OR ATTAINABLE HOUSING, ALL KINDS OF THINGS THAT ARE THAT CAN BE SOMEWHAT

[00:05:03]

CONFUSING OR. YOU KNOW, DIFFICULT TO TALK ABOUT IN A COMMUNITY WHEN YOU CAN PUT THINGS IN TERMS OF THE MONEY, OF WHAT IT'S GOING TO GENERATE TO THE CITY, WHAT IT'S GOING TO COST TO SERVE. IT PROVIDES KIND OF A COMMON LANGUAGE THAT MAKES IT A LITTLE EASIER FOR MORE FOLKS IN THE COMMUNITY TO TALK ABOUT. THE SECOND BULLET THERE, ALIGNING THE PATTERN OF INFRASTRUCTURE AND SERVICES WITH RESIDENTS ARE WILLING AND ABLE TO PAY FOR. I ALREADY MENTIONED THAT ONE. AND THEN AS WE GO FORWARD, THREE, FOUR AND FIVE, GET INTO THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN, YOUR ZONING CODE AND YOUR CAPITAL IMPROVEMENT PLAN, AND INFRASTRUCTURE AND ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT INCENTIVES AND INVESTMENTS. ALL OF THOSE CAN BE ALIGNED TOWARDS HOW DO WE MAKE OUR OR MAKE OUR REVENUE EVEN MORE POSITIVE AND OR CLOSE OUR RESOURCE GAP? SO WHAT WE FOCUS ON IN THIS STUDY IS PRIMARILY PROPERTY TAX AND SERVICES PAID FOR BY PROPERTY TAX. SALES TAX IS PART OF THE EQUATION. WE UNDERSTAND THAT. BUT THE FOCUS HERE IS ON THE DEVELOPMENT PATTERN ITSELF. AND HOW CAN WE GET MORE TAXABLE VALUE PER ACRE OUT OF YOUR DEVELOPMENT. FROM A PROPERTY TAX REVENUE STANDPOINT, AND A LOT OF TIMES WHEN YOU PUT MORE PEOPLE AND THINGS CLOSER TOGETHER, YOU'RE GOING TO JACK UP YOUR OR INCREASE YOUR PROPERTY TAX REVENUE. YOU'RE ALSO GOING TO INCREASE YOUR SALES TAX REVENUE PER ACRE BY DOING THE SAME THING. SO BUT JUST HERE WE'RE FOCUSING ON WHAT WHAT CAN WE CONTROL OR ATTEMPT TO CONTROL WITH THE DEVELOPMENT PATTERN. WHAT IS THE IMPACT TO HAVE ON ON TAXABLE VALUE AND PROPERTY TAX REVENUE. AND THE MORE THAT WE CAN GENERATE TO THE CITY AND PROPERTY TAX REVENUE, THE MORE PRESSURE THAT TAKES OFF OF SALES TAX OR OTHER FEES AND FINES AND OTHER REVENUE STREAMS TO FUND YOUR SERVICES. SO THREE LEVELS THAT WE LOOK AT HERE. THE FIRST IS WE JUST LOOK AT THE TAXABLE VALUE OF THE LAND AND THE PROPERTY TAX REVENUE PER ACRE. SO EVERY PROPERTY IN THE CITY, WE CAN GET THAT PROPERTY TAX REVENUE PER ACRE NUMBER FOR THE SECOND LEVEL IS WE TAKE CURRENT BUDGET COSTS AND ALLOCATE THOSE TO THE TO THE PROPERTIES. SO JUST WHAT YOU HAVE RIGHT NOW, WHAT YOU'RE SPENDING RIGHT NOW AND IN THE GENERAL FUND BUDGET. AND WE ALLOCATE THAT BACK TO THE PARCELS. AND THEN THE THIRD LEVEL IS WE ADD IN YOUR YOUR DEBT FUNDS. SO WHAT YOU'VE GOT IN THE INS PORTION OF YOUR PROPERTY TAX RATE AND HOW YOU'RE USING THAT TO COVER FUTURE FACILITIES AND MOSTLY INFRASTRUCTURE REPLACEMENT COSTS. SO FIRST LOOKING AT YOUR GENERAL FUND, THE MAIN THING HERE IS JUST LOOKING THAT WE LOOK AT IS WHAT'S YOUR SPLIT BETWEEN YOUR OVERALL GENERAL FUND PROPERTY TAX, SALES TAX AND THEN EVERYTHING ELSE. YOU KNOW YOU GUYS ARE MOSTLY BUILT OUT. SO YOUR DEVELOPMENT FEE REVENUE IS PRETTY SMALL. IN TERMS OF A PERCENTAGE, IF YOU WERE A YOUNGER, FAST GROWING PLACE, YOU WOULD SEE A MUCH HIGHER PERCENTAGE OF YOUR GENERAL FUND COMING FROM THE DEVELOPMENT DEVELOPMENT FEES. BUT SINCE BEING A MORE MATURE COMMUNITY, YOU'VE GOT MORE OF YOUR YOUR REVENUE COMING FROM PROPERTY TAX, SALES TAX. AND THERE'S SOME OTHER STUFF IN HERE. LANDFILL. GAL, YOU'VE GOT SOME TRANSFERS COMING IN, BUT YOU'VE GOT ROUGHLY IN YOUR FY 25 BUDGET, 50%, HALF OF YOUR GENERAL FUND IS COMING FROM PROPERTY AND SALES TAX, HALF OF IT'S COMING FROM OTHER SOURCES IN CITIES THAT DON'T HAVE THESE OTHER FUNDS, LIKE THE LANDFILL AND GAL. WE OFTEN RECOMMEND A GOAL OF TRYING TO GET TO HAVE 50% OF YOUR GENERAL FUND TO COME FROM PROPERTY TAX. IN YOUR CASE, I THINK GETTING TO 3,540% WOULD BE A GOOD GOAL. WE'LL HAVE MORE SPECIFICS ON THAT NUMBER A LITTLE BIT LATER IN THE PRESENTATION. BUT IF YOU LOOK AT YOUR GENERAL TREND HERE, IF YOU GO BACK IN FISCAL YEAR 21, THE LEFT SIDE OF THE CHART, YOU HAD 34% OF YOUR REVENUE COMING FROM PROPERTY TAX AND ONLY 18 FROM SALES TAX. BUT YOU CAN SEE IN THE LAST FOUR YEARS THE TOTAL AMOUNT OF PROPERTY TAX HAS INCREASED. THE TOTAL AMOUNT OF SALES TAX HAS BEEN PRETTY, PRETTY STABLE. THE LAST, LAST FEW YEARS, THE PERCENTAGE HAS GONE UP SLIGHTLY. BUT WHAT WE WANT TO DO IS HOLD OR INCREASE THAT SALES TAX PERCENTAGE. BUT WE REALLY WANT TO TRY TO BOOST THAT THAT PROPERTY TAX BASE. ANOTHER THING THAT WE LOOK AT JUST AS A BENCHMARK IS LOOK AT YOUR GENERAL FUND REVENUES PER CAPITA, PER HOUSEHOLD AND PER ACRE. WE DO HAVE MORE INFORMATION IN THE FULL STUDY THAT SHOWS HOW THIS BENCHMARKS AGAINST SOME OTHER PLACES. BUT A COUPLE THINGS TO POINT OUT ABOUT YOU ALL. IN THIS CHART, THE DARK BLUE, THE SHORTEST COLUMN IS YOUR GENERAL FUND PER CAPITA. THAT'S JUST YOUR TOTAL GENERAL FUND REVENUE DIVIDED BY YOUR POPULATION. THE MIDDLE GREEN BAR IS YOUR GENERAL FUND PER HOUSEHOLD. SAME THING. TOTAL GENERAL FUND REVENUE DIVIDED BY THE HOUSEHOLDS. IN GARLAND. AND THEN THE THIRD ONE, THE LIGHT GREEN. THE TALLEST BAR IS YOUR GENERAL FUND PER ACRE. WHAT WE'RE LOOKING TO DO OVER TIME IS

[00:10:03]

INCREASE THAT GENERAL FUND PER ACRE. THAT MEANS YOU'RE GETTING MORE PRODUCTIVITY, TAX PRODUCTIVITY OUT OF YOUR DEVELOENT FOOTPRINT. AND IF WE CAN START TO DRIVE DOWN THE GENERAL FUND COST PER HOUSEHOLD OR PER DWELLING UNIT, THE FASTEST WAY TO DO THAT IS DENSITY. THE MORE DENSE YOU GET, THE HIGHER VALUE PER ACRE YOU'RE GOING TO GENERATE, THE HIGHER REVENUE PER ACRE YOU'RE GOING TO GENERATE. AND WITH MORE HOUSEHOLDS AND MORE PEOPLE TO DISTRIBUTE THAT OVER, YOU'RE GOING TO LOWER THAT COST PER HOUSEHOLD. SO WE HAD A LOT OF CONVERSATION ABOUT THIS ONE. IN SOME PLACES, ACTUALLY, IN A IN A LOT OF CITIES THAT WE WORK WITH, FUTURE STREET REPLACEMENT, FUTURE INFRASTRUCTURE REPLACEMENT IS A BIG TOPIC THAT WE TALK A LOT ABOUT. A LOT OF CITIES HAVE NOT BEEN THINKING ABOUT WHAT ARE THE REAL COSTS THAT IT'S GOING TO TAKE TO INVEST EITHER SIGNIFICANT MONEY AND SIGNIFICANT MAINTENANCE OR OR REHAB OF FACILITIES, OR FULL REPLACEMENT OF SOME OF THAT INFRASTRUCTURE. IN GARLAND'S CASE, YOU'RE ON THE RIGHT TRACK. YOUR STAFF HAVE ALREADY LOOKED AT THIS. WE HAVE A BRAND NEW PAVEMENT STUDY THAT WE LOOKED AT. AND WHAT CAME OUT OF THAT AS PART OF THE UPCOMING BOND PROGRAM RECOMMENDATIONS, WAS THE ALTERNATIVE THAT BASICALLY SAID, WHAT DO YOU HAVE TO INVEST IN THE CITY, IN THE SYSTEM TO GET THE CITYWIDE, THE CITYWIDE PAVEMENT INVENTORY UP TO AN OVERALL SCORE OF 77, WHICH IS BASICALLY ABOVE AVERAGE, NOT GREAT, NOT BRAND NEW, BUT ABOVE AVERAGE CITYWIDE. AND TO DO THAT, YOU NEED TO INVEST ROUGHLY $42 MILLION A YEAR FOR THE NEXT ONE, TWO, THREE, FOUR, FIVE YEARS. THAT COMES OUT TO ABOUT 207 MILLION. AND WHAT YOU'RE PROPOSING, WHAT STAFF IS PROPOSING TO DO IS ROLL THAT INTO THIS UPCOMING BOND ELECTION. AND THAT CAN BE COVERED WITH THE INS PORTION. THE INTEREST PORTION OF YOUR PROPERTY TAX RATE, WITHOUT HAVING TO RAISE THE TAX RATE. SO ONE OF THE THINGS WE DID HERE IS TAKE THIS AMOUNT, THIS 42 MILLION, AND PLUG THAT IN AS WHAT I'LL CALL THAT LEVEL THREE ANALYSIS. RIGHT. AND MAKE SURE THAT YOUR THE DEBT PORTION OF YOUR TAX RATE IS GOING TO COVER THIS. SO THE ASSUMPTION HERE IS IF THE BOND ELECTION PASSES IN MAY, YOU'VE GOT THE MONEY THAT YOU NEED TO TAKE CARE OF YOUR STREETS AND YOUR ALLEYS TO GET THEM UP TO UP TO CONDITION. AND THEN WHEN THIS STUFF GETS SPENT, THEN THE NEXT YOU'LL CONTINUE TO SPEND AT THIS LEVEL AND START TO LOOK AT FACILITIES, PARKS, OTHER THINGS THAT ARE GOING TO NEED TO BE MAINTAINED IN THE FUTURE. BUT THE WAY WE MODELED THIS IS THIS IS GOING TO BE KIND OF A STANDING COST ON THE DEBT SIDE OF THE EQUATION. THAT'S GOING TO HELP YOU CATCH UP WITH UNFUNDED FACILITIES AND INFRASTRUCTURE.

DOES THAT MAKE SENSE? SOME A LOT OF PLACES DO NOT HAVE THIS PLAN. THEY'VE GOT A PLAN TO TAKE CARE OF SOME OF IT, BUT THEY'RE NOT TACKLING IT AT THE LEVEL THAT THAT YOU ALL ARE CONSIDERING DOING. SO I WANTED TO MAKE SURE TO APPLAUD YOU ALL FOR THAT. IT'S A BIG IT'S A BIG CHUNK, BUT IT'S A VERY NECESSARY STEP TO TAKE TO SHIFT FROM THAT GROWTH. TO REDEVELOPMENT. OKAY. SO HERE'S HERE'S THE NUMBER. HERE'S THE STORY. HERE'S THE CHALLENGE FOR THE COMP PLAN GOING FORWARD.

WE WORKED WITH WITH MATT, THE CFO. HE PUT TOGETHER SOME PROJECTIONS FOR US GOING ALL THE WAY OUT TO FISCAL YEAR 3334. AND TO SUMMARIZE THIS, BASICALLY WHAT I JUST SAID ON THE DEBT SERVICE. SO IF THE BOND ELECTION PASSES, YOU HAVE YOU HAVE THINGS COVERED ON THE DEBT SIDE TO TAKE CARE OF THE STREETS. ON THE GENERAL FUND OR ON THE M AND O PORTION. THIS IS WHERE YOU HAVE TO CATCH UP OR THIS IS WHERE YOU HAVE TO MAKE UP SOME GROUND. IF WE ASSUME PROPERTY TAX AND SALES TAX INCREASE YEAR OVER YEAR, SOMEWHERE BETWEEN 3 TO 4%. AND THEN LOOKING AT YOUR OTHER EXPENDITURES AND MATT'S GOT THE FULL DETAIL THAT HE CAN SHARE WITH YOU ALL IF YOU WANT TO SEE THAT. BUT BASICALLY WHAT IT COMES OUT TO IS BY FISCAL YEAR 33, 34, JUST TO COVER A PRETTY LEAN BUDGET, WE NEED TO FIND AN ADDITIONAL 14 MILLION IN PROPERTY TAX REVENUE ON THE NO SIDE. IF YOU BACK THAT OUT, THAT COMES OUT TO A TAXABLE VALUE OF 8 BILLION. SO BETWEEN NOW AND FY 3334 WE'VE GOT TO INCREASE THE TOTAL TAXABLE VALUE INSIDE GARLAND CITY LIMITS BY ABOUT 8 BILLION. THERE'S THAT'S THAT'S WHERE WE'RE AT RIGHT NOW. THERE'S SOME ADDITIONAL STRATEGIES ON THE FINANCIAL SIDE AND SHIFTING THINGS. SOME OF THE MONEY AROUND WITHIN THE TAX RATE THAT THAT MIGHT BRING THAT DOWN A LITTLE BIT. BUT THAT'S THE GOAL THAT WE'RE SHOOTING FOR. SO HOW DO WE HOW DO WE GET THAT VALUE. HOW DO WE CLOSE THAT. THE ALTERNATIVE IF WE DON'T GET IT

[00:15:01]

IS SERVICE CUTS OR TAX RE HIKES OR ADDITIONAL FEES, SOMETHING LIKE THAT. SO HOW DO WE START TO IDENTIFY WHERE WE CAN GET THAT ADDITIONAL VALUE. THIS IS WHERE THE MAPS AND THE CHARTS. AND A LOT OF THE DETAILED DATA THAT WE HAVE COMES INTO PLAY. SO ASSESSED VALUE PER ACRE. THIS IS JUST LOOKING AT DALLAS COUNTY. THE PINK IS THE LOWER VALUE. THE PURPLE IS THE HIGHEST VALUE. PROPERTIES. AND YOU CAN KIND OF SEE A LARGE A LARGE PART OF DALLAS COUNTY. IS THAT PINK. SOMETHING THAT WE TALK WITH TALK ABOUT IN DALLAS PROPER AND SOUTHERN DALLAS AND SOUTHERN DALLAS COUNTY IS THE LACK OF INVESTMENT THAT'S BEEN MADE IN SOUTHERN DALLAS. AND YOU CAN REALLY SEE HOW THAT SHOWS UP IN IN THIS MAP ON THE RIGHT, YOU CAN SEE A ZOOMED IN MAP OF GARLAND. BUT THIS IS JUST THE ASSESSED VALUE. SO THIS IS THE TAXABLE VALUE PER ACRE OF ALL OF THE PARCELS IN GARLAND. IT'S A IT'S A LITTLE EASIER TO SEE ON THE SCREEN THAN THIS ONE'S REALLY DARK. BUT SO THEN I'M FLIPPING THESE IN 3D FOR YOU. SO THE THIS IS PROPERTY TAX REVENUE. SO WHEN WE ACTUALLY GO IN AND LOOK AT THE ACTUAL PROPERTY TAX THAT GARLAND COLLECTS. SO WE TAKE OUT EXEMPTIONS, WE TAKE OUT THE OTHER REVENUE THAT GOES TO SCHOOL DISTRICT WHEREVER ELSE. THIS IS JUST CITY OF GARLAND REVENUE. THIS SHOWS YOU AGAIN THE PURPLE THE PURPLE COLOR. THE HIGHEST BARS ARE THE HIGHEST, HIGHEST VALUE PER ACRE. THE THAT LIGHT BLUE COLOR, WHICH IS A LITTLE HARD TO SEE FROM. FROM THIS ANGLE. YOU DON'T HAVE VERY MUCH OF IT IN GARLAND, BUT THAT'S THE THAT'S THE LOWEST. SO THIS IS JUST THE REVENUE SIDE.

THIS IS JUST YOUR PROPERTY TAX REVENUE PER ACRE FOR EVERY PARCEL IN GARLAND. SO THEN THIS IS THE SECOND LEVEL. THIS IS WHERE WE TAKE THE BUDGET, THE GENERAL FUND BUDGET. WE ALLOCATE THAT BACK TO THE PARCELS A COMBINATION OF BASICALLY TWO DIFFERENT PARTS. WE TOOK ANYTHING THAT WAS SERVICE RELATED AND WE ALLOCATED THAT ON A DWELLING UNIT BASIS. SO IF IT'S YOU KNOW, IF IT'S ONE UNIT, FOUR UNITS, WHATEVER THE IDEA IS, THE UNIT IS, IS REALLY THE MAIN THING DRIVING THE CONSUMPTION OF CITY SERVICES AS OPPOSED TO THE SIZE OF THE LOT.

RIGHT. IT'S MORE THE NUMBER OF UNITS THAT ARE CONTRIBUTING TO CONSUMING CITY SERVICES ON THE INFRASTRUCTURE, THINGS LIKE STREET MAINTENANCE, A LITTLE BIT OF PUBLIC WORKS, PARKS, THINGS LIKE THAT. THOSE WERE THOSE WERE ALLOCATED MORE ON A GEOGRAPHIC OR A PARCEL SIZE BASIS WITH THE IDEA THAT THE BIGGER THE PROPERTY IS, THE MORE STREET OR MORE INFRASTRUCTURE THEY'RE THEY'RE USING. THEY'RE FRONTING ON. RIGHT. SO THIS IS THE NET REVENUE PER ACRE. SO YOU CAN START TO SEE THIS IS JUST REVENUE. WHEN WE ADD IN THE COSTS YOU DON'T SEE A HUGE CHANGE. ON AT THIS KIND OF SCALE YOU REALLY HAVE TO KIND OF LOOK INTO THE DATA. BUT YOU CAN STILL YOU CAN SEE THE PARTS OF THE CITY HERE THAT EVEN WHEN, EVEN WHEN WE LOAD IN COSTS, THEY'RE STILL NET POSITIVE. AND WE DID DO THIS ONE WITH THE FULL TAX RATE. SO SOMETIMES WE'LL DO JUST THE, THE OPERATIONS, THE M AND A PORTION OF THE TAX RATE. WITH THIS ONE WE INCLUDED THE FULL THE FULL PROPERTY TAX RATE. BECAUSE OF THIS NEXT LEVEL. SO WHEN WE ADD IN THE DEBT SIDE THIS IS WHAT IT GOES TO. SO THE REASON IN THIS SECOND ONE THAT EVERYTHING IS LOOKING POSITIVE IS BECAUSE WE HAVE THAT ADDITIONAL DEBT PORTION OF THE TAX RATE IN HERE. IF WE PULLED THAT PORTION OUT AND JUST DID THE MATH PORTION AND JUST DID CITY SERVICES AND THE OPERATIONS PORTION OF THE TAX RATE, YOU WOULD SEE A LOT OF THESE PROPERTIES START TO GO RED AT THIS L LEVEL. BUT BECAUSE WE HAE THE FULL TAX RATE IN HERE, THEY'RE ALL STAYING POSITIVE HERE. BUT WHEN WE ADD IN, YOU KNOW THAT THE BOND PROGRAM, THE DEBT FUNDED STUFF, YOU CAN SEE WHAT HAPPENS HERE. BUT THE QUESTION AND WHAT WE START TO LOOK AT IS EVEN WHEN YOU LOAD THESE ADDITIONAL COSTS ON WHAT ARE THE PROPERTIES THAT ARE STILL HOLDING THEIR VALUE AND WHY. RIGHT. THE WAY WE CAPTURE THAT $8 BILLION IS A NUMBER OF DIFFERENT THINGS. IT COULD BE A REAL SMALL INCREMENTAL BUMP OVER A BIGGER AREA. RIGHT. AND THE SOONER THAT HAPPENS, THE BETTER, BECAUSE THEN YOU START TO GET THE COMPOUNDING YEAR OVER YEAR, EVEN IF IT'S JUST A 3% INCREASE, YOU'RE STARTING TO GET THAT INCREASE YEAR OVER YEAR. BY THE TIME YOU GET TO 3334. OR THERE'S GOING TO BE SOME BIG PROJECTS AS WELL THAT ARE GOING TO COME IN AND REDEVELOP AND TAKE SOMETHING THAT MIGHT BE, YOU KNOW, BREAK EVEN RIGHT NOW AND YOU BUMP THAT SIGNIFICANTLY. SO MAPS ARE PART OF THIS, AND I HAVE A NOTE UP THERE AT THE TOP. ONCE WE GET EVERYTHING LOCKED IN AND FINALIZED, WE'LL BE ABLE TO PROVIDE SOME INTERACTIVE 3D MAPS TO STAFF AND YOU ALL SO YOU CAN GET IN HERE, SPIN IT AROUND, ZOOM IN AND OUT, SEE WHATEVER WHATEVER YOU WANT ON INDIVIDUAL

[00:20:03]

AREAS. WE ALSO LOOKED AT THE ZONING SO WE CAN SLICE AND DICE THIS BY ZONING, BY ZONING DISTRICT, BY NEIGHBORHOOD, BY LAND USE CODE. AND THIS SHOWS THE DARK GREEN IS THE NET PER ACRE FOR CURRENT BUDGET. THE LIGHT GREEN IS THE NET PER ACRE. WHEN YOU ADD IN THE DEBT FUNDED COSTS. BUT THIS SHOWS HOW THINGS HOW ALL OF YOUR DIFFERENT ZONING DISTRICTS PERFORM. AND AGAIN, THERE'S A LOT MORE A LOT MORE CHARTSO LOOK AT AND UNPACK. IF YOU WANT TO NERD OUT ON ALL THE DETAILS OF THIS STUFF. BUT ONE OF THE TAKEAWAYS FROM IN GARLAND AND EVERYWHERE. I THINK I MENTIONED THIS IN ONE OF OUR EARLIER PRESENTATIONS. EVERYWHERE WE'VE EVER DONE THIS MODEL, THIS ALWAYS SHOWS THE SAME. THE SMALLEST LOTS. SO WHAT THIS SHOWS IS THE FOR RESIDENTIAL DEVELOPMENT. YOU SEE FROM LEFT TO RIGHT THE SMALLEST SIZED LOTS ARE ON THE LEFT, 0 TO 2500FTā– S. THE LARGEST LOTS ARE N THE RIGHT. THE GRAY BAR IS THE AVERAGE IMPROVEMENT VALUE OF BUILDINGS ON THOSE LOTS. SO BASICALLY THE HOME VALUE OR THE STRUCTURAL VALUE ON THOSE LOTS.

AND THEN THAT GREEN LINE IS THE REVENUE PER ACRE TO THE CITY. SO THOSE SMALLEST LOTS THAT 2500 TO 5000, THEY GENERATE THE HIGHEST REVENUE PER ACRE TO THE CITY. AND THEY TEND TO BE THE MORE ON THE LOWER END OF THE STRUCTURAL VALUE. SO AFFORDABLE ATTAINABLE. AT THE SAME TIME, IF YOU WANT TO, WHAT'S INTERESTING ABOUT YOU ALL IS WHEN YOU GO UP IN LOT SIZE. AND WE'VE TALKED ABOUT THIS A LITTLE BIT TOO, BUT YOUR YOUR 10,000 OR 7000, 10,000, THOSE TWO SIZES, THOSE DON'T HAVE. IF YOU LOOK AT THE REAL SMALL TABLE IN THE BOTTOM RIGHT, YOUR 7000 TO 10,000 SQUARE FOOT LOTS, FOR EXAMPLE, YOUR AVERAGE VALUE ON THOSE IS 212,000, RIGHT? IF YOU COMPARE THAT TO SOME SURROUNDING COMMUNITIES, THAT'S IN THE 300, 300, 50, 400,000 RANGE. SO YOU GUYS HAVE A COUPLE THINGS GOING FOR YOU, RIGHT? THE YOUR SMALLEST, THE FLIP. THE OTHER PART OF THIS IS THAT 2500 TO 5000 SQUARE FOOT LOTS, THAT AVERAGE VALUE OF ALMOST 170,000, THAT'S HIGHER THAN MOST PLACES THAT WE SEE. SO ON THE LOW END OF THIS, YOUR YOUR PROPERTIES ARE A LITTLE BIT HIGHER THAN WHAT WE SEE IN A LOT OF PLACES. AND THEN IN THAT MIDDLE AND LARGER SIZE, YOU'RE NOT YOU'RE NOT AS HIGH OF A PRICE POINT AS YOU SEE. RIGHT. DOES THAT MAKE SOME SENSE? MAKE SENSE? BUT EVERYWHERE WE'VE EVER DONE THIS, THIS ALWAYS SHOWS THE SAME THING. THE SMALLEST LOTS GENERATE THE HIGHEST REVENUE PER ACRE TO THE CITY, AND THEY TEND TO BE THE MOST AFFORDABLE. SO HOW MUCH OF THE HOW MUCH OF THAT DO YOU HAVE? HOW MUCH OF THAT DO YOU WANT? HOW MUCH OF THAT DO YOU NEED? THAT'S PART OF THE CONVERSATION. BUT WHERE WE CAN BUMP THE HIGHER VALUE STUFF IS ALSO SOMETHING THAT WE WANT TO LOOK AT HERE. SINGLE FAMILY RESIDENTIAL REVENUE PER ACRE IN NET PER ACRE BY LOT SIZE. THIS IS ALWAYS. WE ALWAYS HAVE SOME INTERESTING CONVERSATIONS ABOUT ABOUT THIS BECAUSE A LOT OF TIMES WE HEAR WELL, WE THINK THAT LARGER, LARGER, LOTS, LARGER HOMES ARE BETTER FOR THE CITY. NOT ALWAYS. IT DEPENDS ON THE INFRASTRUCTURE AND SOME OTHER THINGS THAT GO WITH IT. BUT WHAT THIS SHOWS IS BASICALLY IN GARLAND, THE BIGGER THE LOT GETS, THAT NET REVENUE GOES DOWN AND ULTIMATELY GOES NEGATIVE, RIGHT? MULTIFAMILY. THERE'S ALWAYS A LOT OF CONVERSATION ABOUT MULTIFAMILY, AND WHETHER OR NOT IT'S GOOD OR BAD FOR A COMMUNITY. MULTIFAMILY IS USUALLY FROM A PROPERTY TAX REVENUE PER ACRE, ONE OF, IF NOT THE BIGGEST MONEY MAKER IN THE CITY. MULTIFAMILY BECAUSE OF THE NUMBER OF UNITS. BECAUSE OF THE SIZE OF THE BUILDINGS, THE DENSITY THAT THEY PACK IN THERE, THEY TEND TO HAVE VERY HIGH TAXABLE VALUE PER ACRE. THE FLIP SIDE OF THAT IS LOOKING AT THE NET PER ACRE AND HOW YOU ALLOCATE THE COST, RIGHT. AND SO THAT'S THAT'S A LITTLE TRICKIER HERE. BUT THE SWEET SPOT HERE IS WHAT WE SEE IN A LOT OF PLACES IS SMALLER SCALE MULTIFAMILY. SO NOT NECESSARILY THE BIG HUGE APARTMENT BUILDINGS THAT YOU SEE A LOT OF. BUT 1624 UNIT BUILDINGS, SOMETHING LIKE THAT, THAT ARE A LITTLE A LITTLE BIT SMALLER, THAT DON'T REQUIRE AS MUCH PARKING. THAT CAN BE A REAL WIN WIN FOR THE CITY AS WELL, BECAUSE THEY'RE THEY'RE GENERATING MORE REVENUE, BUT THEY'RE NOT NOT ADDING AS MUCH IN TERMS OF A SERVICE DEMAND AS SOME OF THOSE LARGER, LARGER

[00:25:04]

COMPLEXES ARE. WE ALSO HAVE THIS SAME KIND OF STUFF FOR COMMERCIAL, INDUSTRIAL, THE OTHER ONES IN HERE TOO, BUT I JUST THE RESIDENTIAL ONES I WANTED TO MAKE SURE I POINTED, POINTED OUT. OKAY. SO THIS SHOWS WHERE THE DEVELOPED PROPERTIES IN GARLAND ARE IN THE DIFFERENT THE DIFFERENT LOT SIZE CATEGORIES. YOU CAN SEE THE THOSE THREE DIFFERENT BARS. WHAT THAT'S SHOWING IS THE DARK GRAY ONE IS THE ACREAGE PERCENTAGE, THE PERCENT OF ACREAGE IN THE CITY. THE LIGHT GRAY ONE IS THE COUNT. SO THE PERCENT OF PARCEL COUNT IN EACH CATEGORY, AND THEN THE GREEN ONE IS THE PERCENT OF TAX REVENUE. EACH CATEGORY GENERATES SO. AND THEN THE GREEN LINE IS THAT REVENUE PER ACRE AGAIN. SO RIGHT THERE IN THE MIDDLE, THE MAJORITY OF THE MAJORITY OF THE DEVELOPED PROPERTIES IN GARLAND ARE IN THAT 7 TO 10,000 SQUARE FOOT RANGE. WHETHER YOU'RE LOOKING AT THAT BY ACREAGE, YOU'RE LOOKING AT THAT BY THE NUMBER OF PROPERTIES OR YOU'RE LOOKING AT IT BY THE REVENUE THAT IT GENERATES. BUT YOU CAN SEE ON THE LEFT WHERE WE HAVE KIND OF THE, THE RECTANGLE THERE, THAT'S THE SMALLER, THAT'S THE SMALLER LOTS THAT HAVE THE REVENUE PER ACRE, THE HIGHER REVENUE PER ACRE TO THE CITY. BUT YOU DON'T HAVE AS MANY OF THOSE. SO AGAIN, KIND OF LOOKING, YOU KNOW, LOOKING DOWN AT THAT CHART, IF YOU IF YOU LOOK AT THAT 2500 TO 5000, THE 5000 TO 7000, THOSE ARE GENERATING PRETTY SOLID REVENUE OR THEY'RE PRETTY SOLID IMPROVEMENT VALUE NUMBERS FOR THOSE SIZE LOTS. AND THE REVENUE PER ACRE IS REALLY SOLID. BUT YOU JUST DON'T HAVE A LOT OF THEM IN THE CITY. SO ONE WAY WE COULD TRY TO GET SOME OF THAT ADDITIONAL $8 BILLION IS MORE OF THE SMALLER PROPERTIES, TAKE BIGGER, TAKE BIGGER LOTS AND SUBDIVIDE THEM INTO TO PUT ADDITIONAL UNITS ON IT. YOU KNOW, WHATEVER, WHATEVER WE CAN DO ON THAT. THAT'S AGAIN, ONE STRATEGY IS JUST MORE SMALLER LOTS, RIGHT? ANOTHER ONE IS HOW DO YOU BUMP THE VALUE OF THE STUFF ON THE RIGHT SIDE OF THIS? SO CAN YOU IF YOU LOOK, FOR EXAMPLE, IF YOU LOOK DOWN AT THAT TABLE AND THIS IS ALL DEVELOPED PARCELS. SO THIS HAS RESIDENTIAL AND COMMERCIAL ALL IN HERE TOGETHER OKAY. BUT LOOK AT THE 5000 TO 7000 SQUARE FOOT LOTS. THE AVERAGE IMPROVEMENT VALUE THERE IS 260,000. THE 7000 TO 10,000 SQUARE FOOT LOTS THAT YOU HAVE. SO MUCH OF THE AVERAGE IMPROVEMENT VALUE OF THOSE IS ACTUALLY LESS. IT GOES DOWN TO 230,000. RIGHT. AND THEN YOU GO UP TO THE 10,000 TO 25,000 SQUARE FOOT LOTS, AND YOUR VALUE GOES BACK UP TO 294, BUT IS A BUMP OF ROUGHLY 30, $30,000 FOR ALL OF THAT ADDITIONAL LAND. ENOUGH, RIGHT? SO RIGHT NOW, JUST QUICKLY LOOKING AT IT, IT'S TO ME IT'S MORE SMALL STUFF, AND IT'S THAT 10,000 TO 25,000. WHAT WHAT'S HAPPENING THERE THAT WHAT CAN WE DO THERE TO GET THOSE VALUES UP? JUST LOOKING AT COMPARING A COUPLE OF EXAMPLES.

YOU GUYS SAW SOME SOME GENERAL ONES IN THE PREVIOUS PRESENTATION COMMUNITY PRESENTATION I DID. BUT THESE ARE ACTUALLY FROM FROM GARLAND ON THE LEFT A MORE TRADITIONAL SINGLE FAMILY HOME, VERY SMALL LOT, YOU KNOW, 0.2 ACRES. YOU CAN SEE THAT PROPERTY TAX REVENUE PER ACRE OF ALMOST 11,000. THE BIG LARGER ESTATE ON THE RIGHT, IT'S OVER AN ACRE, ALMOST ONE AND A HALF ACRES. BUT THAT PROPERTY TAX REVENUE PER ACRE IS 2900, RIGHT? SO SAME PROPERTY TAX RATE. BUT JUST BECAUSE OF THE LOT SIZE AND THE DEVELOPMENT ON IT, IF YOU TOOK EIGHT SIX, TOOK SIX OF THOSE HOMES ON THE LEFT AND PUT THAT ON THAT 1.4 ACRES ON THE RIGHT, JUST THINK OF THE DIFFERENCE IN THE REVENUE PER ACRE TO THE CITY, RIGHT. AND I WOULD SAY PART OF THIS AGAIN, JUST I WANT TO KEEP HITTING THIS, BUT THE VALUE IN GARLAND OF THE PRODUCTS ON THE LEFT IS HIGHER THAN WHAT WE SEE IN A LOT OF PLACES, AND ESPECIALLY IN DALLAS COUNTY, THE VALUE OF IN GARLAND OF WHAT WE SEE ON THE RIGHT IS NOT AS HIGH AS WHAT WE SEE IN OTHER PLACES.

SO TWO THINGS ARE HAPPENING HERE. YOU'RE THE STUFF ON THE LEFT IS REALLY PRODUCTIVE. THE STUFF ON THE RIGHT IS NOT AS PRODUCTIVE AS IT IS IN OTHER PLACES. IF WE ZOOM OUT A LITTLE BIT AND JUST LOOK AT THAT IN A LITTLE BIT BROADER CONTEXT, LOW DENSITY, MEDIUM DENSITY AND A HIGHER DENSITY, WHAT TRADITIONAL GRID NEIGHBORHOOD? THE REVENUE PER ACRE ON THE LOW DENSITY ON THE LEFT IS 1600. THE REVENUE PER ACRE FOR THE MIDDLE ONE AND THE RIGHT ONE ARE PRETTY COMPARABLE. A LOT OF TIMES WHAT WE SEE HERE IS THAT ONE ON THE RIGHT IS SIGNIFICANTLY HIGHER IN

[00:30:09]

THE REVENUE PER ACRE CATEGORY, AND SOMETIMES THE RURAL ESTATE, THE ONE ON THE LOW DENSITY STUFF ON THE LEFT CAN ACTUALLY BE REALLY HIGH AS WELL. IF YOU'VE GOT THE HIGH ENOUGH VALUES, YOU KNOW, SO IF IT'S A LARGE LOT, BUT IT'S A $2 MILLION ESTATE OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT, IT'S GOING TO DO REALLY WELL. ON THE COMMERCIAL SIDE, THIS IS AGAIN JUST THE PROPERTY TAX. WANT TO MAKE SURE WE GOT THE NOTE, THE DISCLAIMER DOWN THERE IN THE BOTTOM LEFT. BUT WE ALSO HAVE SALES TAX. ANY KIND OF COMMERCIAL PROPERTY YOU HAVE IT'S GOING TO ADD SALES TAX TO THE COMMUNITY AS WELL. BUT WHAT WE'RE TRYING TO GET AT HERE IS THINK ABOUT THE DEVELOPMENT PATTERN, HOW YOU USE THE LAND IN GARLAND AS PRODUCTIVELY AS YOU CAN AND GET MORE PROPERTY TAX REVENUE, MORE TAXABLE VALUE AND PROPERTY TAX REVENUE OUT OF IT, AND STILL GET THE SALES TAX ON THE LEFT SIDE IS A BLOCK HERE IN THE DOWNTOWN, A LITTLE UNDER AN ACRE. PROPERTY TAX REVENUE PER ACRE OF OVER 17,000 ON THE SUBURBAN PAD SIDE ON THE RIGHT A LITTLE BIT A LITTLE BIT HIGHER ACREAGE, 1.15 ACRES AND 7000 PER ACRE ON THE PROPERTY TAX REVENUE. BOTH OF THESE GENERATE SALES TAX TO THE CITY. IT'S HARDER TO DO THE DEEP DIVE INTO THE SALES TAX AND SEE EXACTLY WHICH ONE WHICH ONE DOES BETTER. THE POINT HERE IS NOT THAT ONE IS BETTER THAN THE OTHER. IT'S THAT YOU NEED A MIX, RIGHT? AND A LOT OF PLACES IN GARLAND, THIS IS WHAT I WOULD ARGUE IS, IS A STRENGTH OF GARLAND'S IS YOU HAVE NOT BUILT AS MUCH OF THE SUBURBAN PAD SITE STUFF ON THE RIGHT AS SOME OF THE NEWER PLACES HAVE, RIGHT? SO YOU HAVE MORE NEIGHBORHOODS, YOU HAVE MORE COMMERCIAL THAT LOOKS A LITTLE MORE A LITTLE MORE LIKE THAT ON THE LEFT THAT WE CAN WORK WITH, THAT WE CAN REPURPOSE. AND THE STUFF ON THE RIGHT, WHILE IT'S GOOD, ESPECIALLY WHEN IT'S BRAND NEW. IT'S A LITTLE HARDER TO REPURPOSE AND RETROFIT LATER WHEN IT GETS TO THE END OF ITS INITIAL LIFE. THIS ZOOMS OUT A LITTLE BIT MORE AT THE BIG BOX STAGE THE WALMART, THE HOME DEPOT, AND THEN COMPARING THAT TO THE DOWNTOWN BLOCK, YOU CAN SEE THOSE PROPERTY TAX REVENUE PER ACRE NUMBERS DOWN AT THE BOTTOM. THE DOWNTOWN BLOCK DOES THE BEST, BUT THESE ESPECIALLY HOME DEPOT, COSTCO, YOU KNOW, THE BIG ONES LIKE THAT SOMETIMES WALMART, ESPECIALLY WHEN THEY'RE NEWER, THESE CAN BE A BIG MONEY GENERATOR TO THE CITY AS WELL, YOU KNOW, FOR ON THE SALES TAX SIDE. SO AGAIN, THIS ISN'T ALWAYS HAVE TO MAKE SURE TO EMPHASIZE THAT THIS ISN'T SAYING ONE IS BETTER THAN THE OTHER. IT'S JUST LIKE WE WOULD DO WITH A PERSONAL INVESTMENT PORTFOLIO, RIGHT? YOU WANT TO MIX AND MATCH. YOU WANT TO HAVE THINGS OF DIFFERENT SHAPES AND SIZES, FROM A SUSTAINABILITY RESILIENCY STANDPOINT, THOUGH, IT IS A LOT EASIER TO RETROFIT AND HAVE DIFFERENT BUSINESSES GO IN AND OUT OF THE STUFF ON THE RIGHT.

YOU KNOW, THE SMALLER BUILDINGS IN YOUR DOWNTOWN THAN IT IS WHEN ONE OF THOSE BIG BOXES GOES EMPTY, RIGHT? AND WE DO A LOT OF WORK OF RETROFITTING THOSE BIG BOXES IN PLACES. YOU GUYS SAW A COUPLE OF THOSE, OR AT LEAST LEARNED ABOUT A COUPLE OF THOSE ON OUR ON OUR TOUR. SO THOSE, THOSE ON THE LEFT ARE REALLY GOOD WHEN THEY'RE ACTIVE AND THEY'RE CRANKING THE SALES TAX OUT, BUT WHEN THEY START TO GO VACANT THEY CAN BE A REAL THEY USE A LOT OF LAND, TYPICALLY IN REALLY PRIME SITES THAT COULD BE USED FOR OTHER STUFF IN THE FUTURE. SO THINKING ABOUT THINKING AHEAD ABOUT WHERE AND HOW YOU MIGHT REPURPOSE SOME OF THOSE SITES IN THE FUTURE IS SOMETHING THAT WE WANT TO THINK ABOUT AND OR WORKING WITH THE FOLKS THAT ARE THERE AND DOING WHAT'S NEEDED TO KEEP THEM THERE AND KEEP THEM ACTIVE FOR LACK OF A LACK OF A BETTER WORD. SO THE KEY TAKEAWAYS HERE. AND THEN I'VE GOT A COUPLE MORE TO GET THROUGH. AND THEN I'LL TAKE WHATEVER QUESTIONS YOU ALL HAVE ON THE LEFT HERE IS YOUR ANNEXATION. GARLAND'S ANNEXATION OVER TIME SO YOU CAN SEE HOW THE CITY HAS GROWN HORIZONTALLY, JUST EXPANDED ITS SERVICE AREA OVER TIME. ACTUALLY PRETTY EFFICIENT. AGAIN, YOU ALL WENT THROUGH A LOT OF GROWTH IN THE 60S AND 70S BEFORE THE CRAZY SUBURBAN SPRAWL THING IN NORTH TEXAS REALLY STARTED TO HAPPEN, WHERE YOU SEE, OH, LET'S GO CHASE AND ANNEX THIS ONE CORRIDOR OUT FOR LIKE TEN MILES SO THAT WE CAN GET THAT SALES TAX 20 YEARS FROM NOW OR SOMETHING. YOU GUYS GREW INCREMENTALLY, DECADE BY DECADE OUT. THE INTERESTING PART WITH YOU ALL, THOUGH, IS YOU. YOU ADDED SO IN IN 1950. IF YOU LOOK AT THE BULLETS ON THE RIGHT HAND SIDE, IN 1950, YOUR POPULATION DENSITY WAS TWO AND A HALF PEOPLE PER ACRE. SO YOUR SERVICE AREA WAS THAT BLUE AREA KIND OF

[00:35:06]

IN THE CORE, RIGHT WHERE WE ARE NOW BETWEEN 1950 AND 1980, THOSE NEXT 30 YEARS, THAT THAT WAS YOUR REAL SUBURBAN GROWTH SPURT PHASE. WHATEVER. YOU KNOW, WHATEVER YOU WANT TO, WHATEVER YOU WANT TO CALL IT, THAT'S WHERE YOU DID ALL YOUR ANNEXATION. THAT'S WHERE YOU TOOK ON MOST OF WHAT IS NOW YOUR CITY LIMITS TODAY. SO AS YOU AS YOU GREW THERE, AS DEVELOPERS CAME IN AND BUILT THOSE NEIGHBORHOODS, YOUR POPULATION WENT UP TO OVER 139,000. BUT THINK ABOUT THAT WHOLE AREA FROM 1950 TO 1980, ALL THE ROADS, THE WATER, THE SEWER, THE BRIDGES, EVERYTHING THAT GOT BUILT OVER THOSE 30 YEARS RIGHT. AND I THINK I'VE ASKED YOU GUYS THIS QUESTION BEFORE, BUT HOW LONG DOES A ROAD TYPICALLY LAST? HE KNOWS 40 YEARS, RIGHT. SO WHEN DID I JUST SAY MOST OF GARLAND WAS BUILT? YEAH. THAT'S WHY YOU HAVE A $200 MILLION STREET BOND THING HAPPENING. RIGHT? ALL OF THAT STUFF HAS NOW COME DUE. SO IN THAT SAME TIME THOUGH, IN THAT SAME 30 YEARS, YOUR DENSITY WENT FROM TWO AND A HALF PEOPLE PER ACRE TO ALMOST FOUR PEOPLE PER ACRE. SO WHILE YOU WERE TAKING ON MORE STUFF, YOU WERE YOU WERE ALSO ADDING DENSITY, RIGHT? IN A LOT OF PLACES TODAY, WE SEE THEM TAKING ON THE AREA AND BUILDING IN A LOWER DENSITY.

SO THEY'RE TAKING ON MORE STUFF, BUT THEY DON'T HAVE AS MANY PEOPLE OR HOUSEHOLDS TO DISTRIBUTE THAT COST OVER. GARLAND WAS ACTUALLY ADDING AREA, BUT YOU'VE ADDED DENSITY AS WELL. AND THEN IN THE LAST 40 YEARS, FROM 1980 TO 2020, YOUR CITY LIMITS STAYED BASICALLY THE SAME, BUT YOU CONTINUED TO ADD MORE PEOPLE. AND SO YOUR DENSITY WENT FROM 3.9IN 1980 TO ALMOST SEVEN PEOPLE. IT'S OVER SEVEN PEOPLE PER ACRE NOW. SO THAT'S A GOOD THING IN TERMS OF CITY FINANCES, THAT'S A GOOD THING. YOU'RE ADDING MORE PEOPLE IN YOUR FOOTPRINT TO HELP SPREAD THE COSTS OUT ACROSS. ONE OF THE FROM A FINANCIAL SUSTAINABILITY STANDPOINT, ONE OF THE BEST THINGS THE CITY CAN HAVE IS TO BE LANDLOCKED, RIGHT? THE TEMPTATION THAT GROWTH IS GOING TO KEEP GETTING YOU OUT OF WE'RE GOING TO KEEP GROWING, AND THAT REVENUE FROM THE NEW GROWTH IS GOING TO PAY FOR STUFF THAT WORKS, AS LONG AS YOU CAN KIND OF CONTINUE TO GROW. BUT THEN ALL OF US, AT SOME POINT, ALL OF THIS INFRASTRUCTURE THAT GETS BUILT EARLIER ON BY DEVELOPERS WHEN IT HAS TO BE MAINTAINED, JUST THE GROWTH CYCLE ALONE DOESN'T GENERATE THE REVENUE THAT YOU NEED TO COVER THOSE COSTS. SO YOU'RE YOU'RE ONE OF THE FIRST IN THE METROPLEX THAT'S BEEN FORCED TO REALLY DIG INTO THIS. HOW DO WE PAY TO MAINTAIN WHAT WAS ALREADY BUILT? AND DO YOU JUST PUT BACK WHAT'S THERE, OR DO YOU NEED TO START TO CHANGE THAT DEVELOPMENT PATTERN A LITTLE BIT, WHETHER IT'S THE BUILDINGS AND WHAT'S BUILT OR THE INFRASTRUCTURE THAT'S SERVING IT OR SOME COMBINATION, ALL OF THAT HAS IMPACTS ON REVENUES AND COSTS AND THE COST TO HOUSEHOLDS AND TAXPAYERS. I'M LOOKING AT THE GENERAL FUND ASSESSMENT. 51% OF THE GENERAL FUND COMES FROM PROPERTY TAX AND SALES TAX. WE NEED TO INCREASE BOTH BOTH PROPERTY TAX AND SALES TAX IN THE YEARS AHEAD TO COVER YOUR ANTICIPATED EXPENDITURES AND REDUCE A LITTLE BIT OF THE DEPENDANCE ON SOME OF THE OTHER REVENUE STREAMS THAT YOU'VE GOT TODAY. ON THE EXPENSE SIDE, YOUR ADMINISTRATION AND COST TO MAINTAIN AND UPGRADE CITIES, FLEET, INFRASTRUCTURE AND FACILITIES ARE GOING TO CONTINUE TO INCREASE, WHETHER THAT'S STAFF RAISES, PENSIONS, ALL KINDS OF DIFFERENT STUFF IN THERE. BUT THOSE EXPENSES GARLAND IS ALREADY I WANT TO MAKE SURE I SAY THIS TO GARLAND IS VERY, VERY LEAN IN TERMS OF THE STAFF THAT YOU HAVE AND THE RESOURCES THAT YOU HAVE TO WORK WITH FOR THE SIZE OF A CITY THAT GARLAND IS. SO YOUR STAFF ARE STRETCHED WHEN YOU COMPARE YOUR STAFF TO THE AMOUNT OF STAFF AND THE SIZE OF DEPARTMENTS THAT OTHER CITIES, A LOT OF THEM SMALLER THAN GARLAND, HAVE TO HAVE TO WORK WITH. SO WE'RE JUST TALKING NUMBERS TO KIND OF VERY MODEST INCREASES IN THOSE BUDGETS. WHEN WE TALK ABOUT THAT 8 BILLION, IF YOU REALLY WANT TO LEVEL UP AND INCREASE STAFF, ADD STAFF, ADD AMENITIES, WHAT HAVE YOU, WE'RE TALKING EVEN MORE. ON THE FUTURE NEEDS. WE'VE ALREADY TALKED ABOUT THAT FACILITIES AND INFRASTRUCTURE. THAT BOND ELECTION IS PRETTY CRITICAL. I WANT TO MAKE SURE I'M ON THE RECORD SAYING THAT IF THAT BOND ELECTION PASSES, THAT'S A BIG STEP TOWARDS FISCAL HEALTH AND LONG TERM FISCAL SUSTAINABILITY. FOR GARLAND, IF IT DOES NOT

[00:40:03]

PASS, THOSE COSTS DON'T GO AWAY. SO THEN IT BECOMES HOW? HOW DO WE PAY FOR THOSE? DO YOU HAVE TO GET MORE FROM STREET FEES? DO YOU HAVE TO RAISE THE TAX RATE ON THEM AND PUT MORE INTO. NO, THERE'S OTHER THINGS. BUT I THINK RIGHT NOW THE PATH THAT YOU ALL, ALL ARE ON IS THE RIGHT ONE. THE BEST ONE JUST NEEDS TO BE COMMUNICATED THE RIGHT WAY TO YOUR RESIDENTS OF HOW IMPORTANT IT IS. ON HOUSING AND RESIDENTIAL AFFORDABILITY AND ATTAINABILITY TWO DIFFERENT, TWO DIFFERENT THINGS. GARLAND IS DEFINITELY MORE AFFORDABLE THAN SURROUNDING COMMUNITIES, RIGHT? WE'VE HEARD THAT. WE'VE SEEN THAT IN THE DATA. WE'VE HEARD THAT FROM EVERYONE THAT WE'VE TALKED TO. AND I MENTIONED THIS YOUR OLDER TRADITIONAL STYLE NEIGHBORHOODS, THE OLDER, SMALLER LOTS, SMALLER HOMES TEND TO HAVE HIGHER VALUES THAN COMPARABLE STUFF IN OTHER PARTS OF THE COUNTY. AND ON THE FLIP SIDE, THE LARGER, NEWER SUBURBAN STUFF DOES NOT HAVE AS HIGH OF VALUES. THEY'RE ACTUALLY BELOW SIMILAR STUFF IN IN THE METROPLEX. ON THE OPPORTUNITY SIDE, I THINK GETTING SOME HIGHER VALUE OPTIONS IN WHEN WE TALK WITH FOLKS SO FAR, YOU KNOW, THE INTEREST IN MOVE UP HOUSING TO BE ABLE TO MOVE UP AND STAY IN GARLAND, THAT'S IMPORTANT. AND WE NEED TO FIND WAYS TO DO THAT. IT DOESN'T ALWAYS HAVE TO BE A LARGER SINGLE FAMILY HOME, THOUGH. A LOT OF PEOPLE, WHEN THEY'RE LOOKING FOR MOVE UP, IT COULD BE EVEN MORE SO TODAY. IT'S A HIGH END TOWNHOME IN A WALKABLE KIND OF DOWNTOWN SETTING OR SOMETHING. I MEAN, I'LL GIVE YOU AN EXAMPLE. SOME PRETTY SMALL 1000 SQUARE FOOT TOWNHOMES IN FRISCO ARE GOING FOR MORE THAN A LOT OF THEIR ONE ACRE ESTATE. LOTS ARE JUST BECAUSE OF HOW HIGH DEMAND THAT THAT KIND OF PROPERTY IS. SO WE CAN GET HIGHER VALUE WITHOUT HAVING TO TAKE UP A LOT OF LAND. BUT I THINK ALSO, IF WE HAVE SOME PLACES TO GET SOME LARGER ESTATE KIND OF STUFF, I THINK THAT'S IMPORTANT TO THINK ABOUT WHERE THAT COULD HAPPEN IN GARLAND AS WELL. THE OTHER ONE THAT THAT I WANT TO MENTION IS JUST DOWNTOWN WHERE WE ARE. AND THESE NEIGHBORHOODS AROUND HERE, EVERYONE ON OUR TEAM, WHETHER IT'S OUR VIRGINITY FOLKS, IF IT'S TONY AND HORSE HILL ON THE MARKET SIDE, YOU ALL HAVE, WE SEE A HUGE OPPORTUNITY FOR GARLAND. HOW MANY OF YOU ALL ARE FAMILIAR WITH WITH OAK CLIFF AND OAK CLIFF AND BISHOP ARTS? OKAY, 20 YEARS AGO, NOT A LOT HAPPENING. LOWER VALUES, A LITTLE BIT OF LOCALLY LED INVESTMENT AND IT'S EXPLODED, RIGHT? I JUST HAD A COUPLE OF MY TEAM LOOK AT SOMETHING EARLIER TODAY BECAUSE I WAS JUST CURIOUS HOW TAKE IT'S ABOUT 95 ACRES RIGHT IN THE HEART OF BISHOP ARTS. IN 2020. THE AVERAGE TAXABLE VALUE OF PROPERTIES IN THAT AREA WAS ABOUT 480,000. IN 2024, 900,000. THAT'S THE TAXABLE VALUE. THAT'S THE AVERAGE TAXABLE VALUE OF A PROPERTY OF A PARCEL IN BISHOP ARTS. AND I THINK IT MIGHT HAVE BEEN YOU WHEN WE WERE ON OUR BUS TOUR AND YOU WERE LOOKING UP A COUPLE OF THOSE PROPERTIES AROUND TYLER STATION AND. RIGHT.

AND IT WAS LIKE SO, SO THAT, KIND OF THAT KIND OF NEIGHBORHOOD THAT'S KIND OF GRITTY AND WALKABLE, CLOSE TO A TRAIN STATION. WHAT BISHOP ARTS AND BISHOP ARTS WASN'T REALLY CLOSE, ISN'T REALLY CLOSE TO A TRAIN STATION. RIGHT. BUT YOU HAVE A LOT OF NEIGHBORHOODS THAT ARE RIGHT RIGHT HERE CLOSE TO DOWNTOWN. THEY'RE VERY CLOSE TO THE TRAIN STATION. THE OTHER PART, THOUGH, IS THEY'RE ALSO PRETTY CLOSE TO MORE OF THE NEWER SUBURBAN KIND OF AMENITIES, THE LARGER GROCERY STORES, FOR EXAMPLE, THOSE NEIGHBORHOODS RIGHT IN DOWNTOWN AND ALL AROUND HERE ARE REALLY, REALLY, REALLY GOOD OPPORTUNITIES TO DO SOMETHING LIKE BISHOP ARTS. MAYBE NOT EXACTLY LIKE IT, BUT HOW C YOU INCREMENTALLY ENHANCE THOSE NEIGHBORHOODS IF YOU DID JUST A LITTLE BIT IN THAT AREA AROUND DOWNTOWN? HAVEN'T DONE THE NUMBERS YET, BUT THAT PROBABLY GETS YOU A PRETTY GOOD CHUNK TOWARDS YOUR EIGHT YEAR, 8 BILLION, RIGHT? THAT'S A HUGE OPPORTUNITY. THERE'S A LOT OF PEOPLE THAT ARE LOOKING FOR WALKABLE, MIXED USE NEIGHBORHOODS, ESPECIALLY THE YOUNGER FOLKS THAT WANT TO BUILD WEALTH. THEY CAN'T AFFORD IT, CAN'T AFFORD A $250,000 STARTER HOME. THEY WOULD LOVE TO GET INTO A FIXER UPPER AND OWN IT, OWN IT, FIX IT, INVEST IN IT. THERE'S A LOT OF STUFF THAT Y'ALL COULD DO THERE WITH WITH MARKETING TO THAT SPECIFIC AUDIENCE AND JUST RETAINING THE FOLKS THAT YOU HAVE IN GARLAND. SO HUGE OPPORTUNITY ON THE RESIDENTIAL, ON THE RESIDENTIAL SIDE THERE, ON THE COMMERCIAL AND INDUSTRIAL SIDE, INDUSTRIAL IS AN ABSOLUTE HOME RUN FOR

[00:45:01]

GARLAND. THE INDUSTRIAL STUFF IN GARLAND IS JUST THE GIFT THAT KEEPS ON GIVING VERY, VERY HIGHLY PRODUCTIVE DEVELOPMENT WHEN IT NEEDS TO CONTINUE TO BE PART OF GARLAND'S IDENTITY. AND IT'S REALLY IMPORTANT TO YOUR FISCAL HEALTH AS WELL. AND IF YOU GO BACK AND LOOK AT THE VALUE PER ACRE MAPS LATER, YOU'LL SEE YOUR INDUSTRIAL PROPERTIES ARE A BIG PART OF THOSE PURPLE PURPLE ONES. COMMERCIAL AND SALES TAX. HAZEL TONY AND HIS TEAM ARE FINISHING UP THE MARKET STUDY. THEY'RE BUILDING ON WHAT WAS DONE WITH THE ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT STRATEGIC PLAN, KIND OF FILLING IN SOME HOLES, UPDATING SOME DATA, DOING SOME MORE DETAILED PEER COMMUNITY COMPARISONS. BUT WHAT WE'VE SEEN SO FAR IS THAT YOUR SALES TAX REVENUE. GARLAND.

SALES TAX REVENUES ARE LOWER THAN OTHER BENCHMARK COMMUNITIES, BUT THEY'RE STABLE.

AND I THINK MAYBE I DON'T REMEMBER IF IT WAS JACOB OR ARCO THAT SAID THIS, BUT THE NUMBERS KIND OF BACK IT UP. MOST OF YOUR COMMERCIAL ACTIVITY IS RELATED TO DAILY NEEDS AND SERVICES, SO IT'S NOT STUFF THAT'S GOING TO BE CYCLICAL AND GO UP AND DOWN. IT'S PEOPLE ARE SPENDING MONEY ON WHAT THEY REALLY NEED, RIGHT. BUT WHAT YOU DON'T HAVE IS RETAIL AND THE OTHER DISCRETIONARY SPENDING KIND OF THINGS. AND HOW AND WHERE CAN WE GET MORE OF THAT, REGARDLESS OF SCALE, IF YOU'RE TALKING DOWNTOWN OR IF YOU'RE TALKING A BRAND NEW MIXED USE URBAN VILLAGE THING, PEOPLE PLACE EXPERIENCE BASED STUFF IS WHAT YOUR RETAIL FOLKS WANT. NOW THAT'S EVEN WHAT YOUR EMPLOYERS WANT NOW. THEY WANT. THEY WANT PLACES WHERE PEOPLE CAN GET OUT, INTERACT, EXPERIENCE THINGS. IT'S NOT AS MUCH OF WE WANT TO, YOU KNOW, A 20 STORY TOWER ON THE TOLLWAY, AND WE'RE GOING TO THROW ALL OF OUR AMENITIES INSIDE THE BUILDING, RIGHT? SO PEOPLE PLACE EXPERIENCE BASED STUFF AT DIFFERENT KINDS OF DIFFERENT SCALES. AND THEN LOOKING AT THE WHOLE SPECTRUM OF INFILL AND REDEVELOPMENT, EVERYTHING FROM INCREMENTAL INFILL ON A VACANT LOT IN DOWNTOWN, ADDING A SECOND STORY TO A BUILDING IN DOWNTOWN, DOING SOME INCREMENTAL INFILL ON A STRIP CENTER OR SHOPPING CENTER TO A COMPLETE SCRAPE AND REDEVELOP THE WHOLE THE WHOLE SPECTRUM OF THINGS HAS TO BE ON THE TABLE FROM AN ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT STANDPOINT. THE DEVELOPMENT PATTERN ITSELF, JUST TO HIT HERE 60%, I'M SORRY, 43% OF YOUR AREA IS SINGLE FAMILY RESIDENTIAL. THAT GENERATES 60% OF YOUR PROPERTY TAX REVENUE.

COMMERCIAL TAKES UP 21% OF YOUR LAND, GENERATES JUST 26% OF YOUR PROPERTY TAX REVENUE, BUT DOES GENERATE THE SALES TAX. SO AS WE LOOK TO THE REST OF THE WAY ON THE COMP PLAN, HOW DO WE TAKE THIS INFORMATION AND USE IT TO INFORM GOING FORWARD THE MAIN OBJECTIVE? I THINK WHY OUR TEAM WAS SELECTED FOR THIS IS OUR WHOLE PROCESS IS ABOUT THIS CONNECTING THINGS TO THE TO THE MONEY AND THE MATH AND THE FINANCIAL HEALTH AND SUSTAINABILITY OF YOUR CITY.

HAVING THE HARD CONVERSATIONS WITH YOU ALL, WITH STAFF, WITH WITH RESIDENTS ON WHAT IT'S GOING TO TAKE TO CLOSE THAT GAP. AND SO EVERYTHING THAT WE GO GO FORWARD, IF IT'S LAND USE, IF IT'S INFRASTRUCTURE, IF IT'S HOUSING, WHATEVER IT IS, WE'RE GOING TO TRY TO CONNECT IT BACK TO. WE NEED TO FIND AN ADDITIONAL $8 BILLION IN TAXABLE VALUE. FUTURE LAND USE AND PLACE TYPES. YOU ALL YOUR LAST. YOUR PREVIOUS COMP PLAN WAS ALREADY GOING DOWN THIS PATH, BUT THERE'S MORE INTEREST TODAY IN MIXED USE NEIGHBORHOODS AT DIFFERENT SCALE, HAVING DIFFERENT THINGS CLOSER TOGETHER AT THE RIGHT CONTEXT. SO YOU'RE NOT GOING TO TAKE A TEN STORY APARTMENT BUILDING AND PUT IT RIGHT SMACK IN THE MIDDLE OF A SINGLE FAMILY SUBURBAN NEIGHBORHOOD. BUT YOU MIGHT TAKE A CORNER OR AN INTERSECTION IN THAT SINGLE FAMILY NEIGHBORHOOD AND TURN THAT INTO A SMALL COFFEE SHOP NEIGHBORHOOD. YOU KNOW, SOMETHING LIKE THAT. THAT BRINGS SOME THINGS CLOSER, MORE WALKABLE TO THAT NEIGHBORHOOD, A MIX OF STUFF AT DIFFERENT CONTEXTS, AND MAKING SURE PEOPLE UNDERSTAND THAT THERE'S SOME CERTAINTY WITH WHAT KIND OF CHANGE TO EXPECT IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD. PEOPLE PEOPLE DON'T WANT THEY DON'T WANT TO SEE A PLACE. THEY DON'T WANT TO LOOK AT A PLACE TYPE MAP AND SEE THEIR NEIGHBORHOOD, THAT SINGLE FAMILY TODAY, AND THEN LOOK AND SAY, OH, THIS IS AN URBAN VILLAGE. WHAT? THAT DOESN'T MAKE SENSE, RIGHT? SO WE HAVE TO HAVE THE RIGHT, THE RIGHT DIFFERENT SCALES. AND IN GARLAND, IT'S PROBABLY GOING TO BE A NUMBER OF THEM. BECAUSE YOU HAVE SUCH DIVERSITY HERE IN THE DIFFERENT NEIGHBORHOODS AND THE ONES THAT WANT OR NEED TO STAY THE SAME, AND THE ONES THAT CAN CHANGE.

THE OTHER THING THAT WE'RE GOING TO LOOK AT FOR YOU ALL IS SOME KIND OF A GROWTH MANAGEMENT STRATEGY IS WHERE AS WELL. SO PRESERVE, ENHANCE, DEVELOP, REDEVELOP. THIS IS WHAT WE TYPICALLY USE FOR MORE MATURE COMMUNITIES. SO PARTS OF YOUR CITY ARE GOING TO BE PRESERVED

[00:50:04]

MEANING WE'RE GOING TO WE WANT TO KEEP THESE THE WAY THEY ARE. WE DON'T WE DON'T WANT THESE TO CHANGE. WE DON'T NEED THESE TO CHANGE. THESE ARE GOING TO STAY THE WAY THEY ARE. SO ANYBODY THAT'S IN A SECTOR LIKE THAT, THEY KNOW WHAT WHAT I SEE TODAY IN MY NEIGHBORHOOD IS WHAT I'M GOING TO EXPECT IN THE FUTURE. SOME PLACES ARE GOING TO HAVE AN OPPORTUNITY, AN OPPORTUNITY TO BE ENHANCED. THAT JUST MEANS SIMILAR CHARACTER, BUT INCREMENTAL INCREMENTAL DENSITY CHANGES. AND THEN THE THIRD ONE IS THE DEVELOP REDEVELOP. THAT'S MORE AGGRESSIVE STUFF. SO IT COULD BE A PROPERTY THAT'S GOT SOMETHING ON IT TODAY AND IT JUST NEEDS TO GO AND BE REDEVELOPED. OR IT COULD BE A GREENFIELD SITE. BUT WHEN YOU PAIR UP THE PLACE TYPES THAT TALK ABOUT WHAT'S WHAT DO WE WANT THINGS TO LOOK LIKE AND THE GROWTH MANAGEMENT OR THE GROWTH SECTORS, HOW WE HOW DO WE GO FORWARD WITH YOU ALL THAT'S GOING TO SAY HOW FAST AND TO KIND OF THE LEVEL OF CHANGE TO EXPECT THOSE TWO THINGS WORK TOGETHER TO HELP THE COMMUNITY AND PROPERTY OWNERS UNDERSTAND WHERE AND HOHOW THINGS ARE GOING TO CHANGE. THIS IS SOMETHING IT'S A BIG PART OF REDEVELOPMENT COMMUNITIES. IT'S SOMETHING THAT WE'VE LEARNED WORKING WITH OTHER PLACES AROUND THE COUNTRY. TEXAS REDEVELOPMENT. INFILL DEVELOPMENT IS NEW IN TEXAS.

WE'RE EVEN IN NORTH TEXAS. WE STILL HAVE A LOT OF GREENFIELD. WE HAVE A LOT OF NEW DEVELOPMENT STILL, BUT GARLAND IS SHIFTING INTO THAT REDEVELOPMENT STAGE. THIS KIND OF REDEVELOPMENT, INFILL DEVELOPMENT, INCREMENTAL DEVELOPMENT WITH LOCALS IS A REALLY, REALLY IMPORTANT STRATEGY IN PLACES LIKE MEMPHIS, PLACES LIKE A SHREVEPORT, PLACES LIKE SOUTH BEND, INDIANA THAT YOU'LL SEE HERE. THIS IS ONE THAT MONTY ANDERSON IS WORKING ON UP IN UP IN SOUTH BEND. AN EXAMPLE. AND I JUST WANT TO HIGHLIGHT THIS ONE. I THINK THIS IS SUCH AN OPPORTUNITY IN GARLAND TOO, BECAUSE IT FITS THE NATURE OF WHO GARLAND IS. AND I THINK YOU HAVE PEOPLE IN GARLAND THAT WOULD WANT TO EXECUTE THIS KIND OF MODEL. BUT THOSE HOMES THERE ON THAT TOP IMAGE. MIKE KEANE IS A LOCAL GUY THERE IN SOUTH BEND. HE'S A RETIRED TEACHER, TAUGHT SUSTAINABILITY KIND OF STUFF, BUT WANTED TO DO SOMETHING AFTER RETIREMENT, WANTED TO BE A DEVELOPER, GOT A LITTLE BIT OF TRAINING AND STARTED TO SAY, YOU KNOW, I WANT TO BE THE LEAD DEVELOPER IN MY NEIGHBORHOOD. THIS PORTAGE MIDTOWN NEIGHBORHOOD TOOK A COUPLE OF PROPERTIES, STARTED TO FLIP AND REDEVELOP THEM INTO WHAT USED TO BE ONE SINGLE FAMILY. AND NOW HE'S PUT A I THINK THE ONE ON THE LEFT IS A DUPLEX DUPLEX. THE ONE ON THE RIGHT IS A MIXED USE BUILDING.

BUT THE MOST IMPORTANT PART OF THIS IS THAT BOTTOM RIGHT CHART, RIGHT. AND IT SHOWS THE VALUE THAT THE COLLECTIVE PROPERTIES THAT HAVE BEEN DONE IN THAT NEIGHBORHOOD HAVE ADDED OVER THE FEW YEARS THAT THEY'VE BEEN DOING THIS. SO WHEN YOU TAKE A PROPERTY AND IT'S HARD TO SEE AT THIS, AT THIS SCALE, I'M HAPPY TO SHARE MORE DETAILS WITH IT. BUT THE IDEA HERE IS IF YOU GET TWO OR 3 OR 4 PEOPLE IN A NEIGHBORHOOD AND THEY START TO INCREMENTALLY REVITALIZE THEIR OWN HOME, MAYBE THEY PUT AN ACCESSORY DWELLING UNIT IN THE BACK, OR JUST THEY FIX UP THE FACADE, JUST INDIVIDUAL INCREMENTAL IMPROVEMENTS CAN REALLY BUMP THE VALUE OF THAT NEIGHBORHOOD. AND IT DOES IT IN A WAY THAT THAT CULTIVATES WEALTH FOR THE PEOPLE THAT ARE THERE. IT DOESN'T PUSH ANYBODY OUT, BUT IT IMPROVES THEIR NEIGHBORHOOD WITH AND BY AND FOR THE PEOPLE THAT ARE THAT ARE LIVING THERE. SO A HUGE PART OF THE STRATEGY THAT THAT I THINK IS AN OPPORTUNITY IN GARLAND, THE MOBILITY SYSTEM, YOU GUYS ARE WELL ON YOUR WAY. YOU'VE GOT YOU'VE GOT THE DART, YOU'VE GOT SOME GOOD STUFF GOING IN. THIS IS ONE THAT THAT I WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT WE LOOK AT GOING GOING FORWARD TO LOOK AT WHERE, YOU KNOW, WITH YOUR WITH YOUR TRANSPORTATION SYSTEM, ALL OF THE SIX LANE ROADS THAT YOU HAVE. DO THEY ALL HAVE THE TRAFFIC COUNTS ON THEM THAT THEY STILL NEED TO BE SIX LANES? CAN SOME OF THEM GO DOWN TO FOUR LANES? CAN WE ADD SOME BIKE LANES? IT HAS TO BE CONNECTED. WHATEVER YOU DO TRANSPORTATION WISE HAS TO BE CONNECTED TO THE LAND USE, RIGHT? LAND USE AND TRANSPORTATION ARE DIRECTLY CONNECTED. SO IF YOU BUILD A BUNCH OF LAND, USE A BUNCH OF DEVELOPMENT THAT REQUIRES DRIVING, YOU'RE GOING TO NEED MORE LANES AND MORE ROADS, RIGHT? IF YOU START TO BUILD MORE WALKABLE PLACES, YOU'RE GOING TO START TO TAKE SOME OF THOSE TRIPS OFF THE ROAD, AND EVENTUALLY YOU CAN START TO RIGHTSIZE AND REDUCE SOME OF THOSE STREETS. AND IF Y'ALL DON'T REMEMBER THE NUMBER 1 TO $2 MILLION PER LANE MILE. SO IF YOU CAN TAKE, YOU KNOW, ONE MILE OF A SIX LANE ROAD AND TURN IT INTO A FOUR LANE ROAD, YOU JUST SAVED YOURSELF 2 TO 4 MILLION BUCKS PER MILE, RIGHT? SO IT'S NOT JUST ABOUT, OH, WE NEED THIS LANE OR WE DON'T. IT TIES DIRECTLY BACK TO THE MATH OF WHAT THINGS COST. BUT THE GOAL, THE GOAL HERE IS TO ALIGN YOUR MOBILITY SYSTEM WITH WHAT YOU HAVE, THE DEVELOPMENT PATTERN THAT YOU HAVE TODAY, BUT ALSO WHAT YOU WANT IN THE FUTURE IN TERMS OF WHICH WHICH NEIGHBORHOODS HAVE POTENTIAL TO BE MORE WALKABLE, MORE BIKEABLE, AND WHICH ONES ARE AUTO CENTRIC AND NEED TO STAY AUTOCENTRIC.

[00:55:02]

AND I THIHINK THAT WAS IT. I DOT KNOW, I DON'T KNOW WHAT THAT. OH, THERE YOU GO. I DON'T KNOW WHAT THAT SLIDE WAS. THE BLACK HOLE. OKAY. THAT'S IT. THANK YOU ALL FOR YOUR ATTENTION FOR A LONG PRESENTATION. OKAY. THANK YOU SO VERY MUCH, KEVIN, FOR THAT PRESENTATION. VERY CHALLENGING PRESENTATION THAT YOU'VE PRESENTED TO US. I THINK AT THIS TIME WE PROBABLY WILL GO TO OUR DISCUSSIONS, QUESTION AND ANSWERS. SO OPEN. ARE WE ON THE BOARD ALREADY? OKAY. LET'S START WITH COUNCIL MEMBER BASS. THANK YOU KEVIN, THANKS FOR THE PRESENTATION. IT WAS REALLY INFORMATIVE. A COUPLE THINGS. ONE, I WOULD LIKE TO BE MADE AVAILABLE TO US. YOU MENTIONED THE WE TALKED ABOUT THE FUNDING PER ACRE COMPARED WITH OTHER CITIES. I'D LIKE TO SEE HOW WE COMPARE WITH OTHER CITIES ON THAT. AND IT'S ALWAYS INTESTING. AND THEN COULD YOU GO BACK TO THE SLIDE THAT YOU HAD THE BIG BOX STORES ON? THAT'S ALWAYS SO THAT ONE RIGHT THERE. YEAH, JUST LOOKING AT THAT AND I'M NOT SURE IF IT'S POSSIBLE, BUT THAT'S NOT REALLY APPLES TO APPLES. AND AGAIN I'M NOT SURE IF IT'S POSSIBLE TO HAVE AN APPLES TO APPLES COMPARISON BECAUSE ON BOTH OF THE BIG BOX YOU HAVE PARKING INCLUDED. AND IN THE DOWNTOWN YOU IT DOESN'T HAVE PARKING INCLUDED. SO WHICH I WOULD THINK WITH THE AMOUNT OF PARKING IN THERE, THAT WOULD BE QUITE AN ADJUSTMENT AND MAKE THEM A LITTLE MORE, A LITTLE MORE COMPARABLE. IS THERE A POSSIBLY A WAY TO MAKE THOSE COMPARISONS MORE APPLES TO APPLES? WE NEED TO FIND THE YEAH, WE NEED TO FIND THE RIGHT PART OF GARLAND. BUT TO TWO THINGS. WE'D WANT TO GET A GOOD MIX. USUALLY I TRY TO GET SOME PARKING IN THERE AND TRY TO GET SOME OPEN SPACE IN THERE AS WELL. SO YEAH, WE CAN WE CAN DO THAT. WHAT WHAT ARE THE. YEAH. BECAUSE THE DOWNTOWN ONE DOESN'T HAVE ANY PARKING AT ALL IN THERE. BUT THAT PARKING WOULD ALSO BE SHARED WITH OTHER PLACES DOWNTOWN. SO IT MIGHT BE KIND OF HARD TO DO, BUT THERE'S AN EXCESSIVE AMOUNT OF PARKING ON THE OTHERS. YEAH. YOU BASICALLY GET INTO WITH THE DOWNTOWN, MORE URBAN ENVIRONMENT, YOU START TO GET INTO SHARED STRATEGIES. SO SHARED PARKING, SHARED STORMWATER MANAGEMENT, SHARED STUFF. BUT IT IS STILL IT DOES. YOU KNOW, JUST EVEN JUST LOOKING AT THIS AREA RIGHT, RIGHT THERE, I MEAN YOU, YOU DO HAVE ON STREET PARKING. THAT'S PART OF IT. BUT EVEN IF YOU IF WE EXPAND THAT AND CAPTURE THE GARAGE OR I'LL LOOK AT A COUPLE OF DIFFERENT WAYS. YEAH. THANKS. I'D JUST LIKE TO SEE A LITTLE MORE APPLES TO APPLES. OKAY.

THANKS, KEVIN. YES, SIR. THANK YOU, THANK YOU SIR. COUNCILMAN WILLIAMS. THANKS, KEVIN, FOR THE PRESENTATION. FLASHBACKS TO THE TOUR OF THINGS. JUST A COUPLE OF QUESTIONS. ONE. ARE YOU GOING TO COVER ANY CHANGES THAT YOU FEEL WE NEED TO MAKE IN OUR ZONING ORDINANCES? NUMBER ONE IS AT THE END OF THE. YOU DON'T HAVE TO. YOU DON'T HAVE TO ANSWER TONIGHT. SO NOT NOT YET BECAUSE WE WANT TO LOOK AT THE LAND USE. WE'RE GOING TO WORK THROUGH THE WHOLE THE WHOLE PROCESS AND THEN SEE, YOU KNOW, SEE WHAT'S NEEDED WHERE. BUT THAT THAT'S TOWARDS THE END OF A LOT OF TIMES IT DOES COME DOWN TO. OR DOES YOUR ZONING CODE ALLOW SMALLER LOTS? I WOULD DEFINITELY LIKE TO SEE THAT, YOU KNOW, THINGS LIKE WHAT? WHAT KIND OF NEIGHBORHOOD DESIGN REQUIRES ALLEYS AND REAR ENTRY VERSUS FRONT ENTRY. I KNOW ONE OF THE THINGS THAT WE SAW IN THE FIRST TOUR THAT WE TOOK WITH STAFF IS YOU HAVE SOME OF YOUR OLDER NEIGHBORHOODS THAT HAVE NARROWER STREETS, AND THEY ALSO HAVE PRETTY NARROW FRONT YARDS AND SHORT DRIVEWAYS. SO YOU END UP WITH CARS PARKED EVERYWHERE ON THE STREET AND YOU CAN'T. OKAY. SO THAT WILL BE A PART OF THE FINAL REPORT. YEAH. OKAY.

ALL RIGHT. I'D LIKE TO SEE THAT AT LEAST AT LEAST AT A HIGH LEVEL. YEAH. OKAY. AND SECONDLY, I HADN'T TOUCHED ON A LOT. BUT ARE THERE AVAILABLE INCENTIVES THAT WE CAN USE AS A CITY ON THE COMMERCIAL AND INDUSTRIAL SIDE? WE'LL TALK ABOUT? I, I'D LIKE TO SEE WHAT WHAT YOUR FINAL REPORT RECOMMENDS IN THAT AREA, BECAUSE SOME OF THE PLACES THAT WE SAW ON THE TOUR, THEY WERE SPARKED BASED ON CONVERSATIONS, WE HAD SOME THAT WERE INCENTIVIZED. BISHOP ARTS AREA. SO I'D VERY MUCH BE INTERESTED IN WHAT WHAT WHAT CAN WE MAKE AVAILABLE? WHAT CAN WE AFFORD TO INCENTIVIZE? DEVELOPMENT OF THE COMMERCIAL AND INDUSTRIAL SIDE, DIFFERENT TOOLS IN THE TOOLBOX, WHETHER IT'S INCENTIVES, DIFFERENT TYPE OF AGREEMENT STRUCTURES, ALL OF THE ALPHABET SOUP, TIF TERS.

RIGHT. YOU KNOW, ET CETERA. ALL OF THOSE THINGS ARE ON THE TABLE. BUT SOMETIMES, SOMETIMES

[01:00:01]

WHAT I'VE LEARNED IS FOR SOME OF THE SMALLER INCREMENTAL STUFF, THEY DON'T THEY DON'T NECESSARILY NEED INCENTIVES. THEY JUST NEED PERMISSION TO DO WHAT MAKES SENSE THAT THE CODE WON'T LET THEM DO. AND THEN THE NEXT LEVEL UP FROM THAT ON THE SMALL DEVELOPER SIDE IS SOMETIMES THEY DO NEED FUNDING. THEY HAVE A GOOD IDEA. THEY'D BE A PERFECTLY CAPABLE PERSON TO DO IT AND GET IN AND OPERATE IT. THEY JUST DON'T HAVE THE CASH TO GO GET THAT UPFRONT, YOU KNOW, UPFRONT LOAN. SO THOSE ARE THOSE ARE TWO ON THE LOW END. AND THEN ALL THE WAY UP TO THE, YOU KNOW, THE THINGS THAT THERE'S ALL KINDS OF DIFFERENT INCENTIVE STRUCTURES YOU CAN DO FOR, YOU KNOW, SOME OF THE DIFFERENT SHOPPING CENTER SITES THAT WE LOOKED AT, STUFF LIKE THAT. SO EVERYTHING EVERYTHING'S ON THE TABLE, BUT THEY NEED TO BE PRIORITIZED AND FOCUSED IN GETTING THE KIND OF DEVELOPMENT IN THE AREAS THAT YOU NEED IT TO GENERATE THAT REVENUE PER ACRE BUMP THAT WE'RE THAT WE'RE TALKING. SO DON'T JUST INCENTIVIZE BLINDLY, BUT DO IT WITH A PURPOSE. YEAH, YEAH, YEAH. I'D LIKE TO SEE YOU WITH WHAT DO YOU THINK? WHAT DO YOU THINK FITS WHERE NOT EVERYTHING IS GOING TO. IT'S NOT A BLANKET AND BUT I'D LIKE TO SEE SOME SORT OF A CHART OR SOMETHING THAT YOU FEEL THAT IN THIS CASE, THESE ARE EXAMPLES. AND THIS IS WHERE INCENTIVES WILL PROBABLY SHOULD BE CONSIDERED TO BE APPLIED IN CERTAIN CASES. I'D LIKE TO KNOW WHAT ARE THOSE, WHAT ARE THOSE SOME EXAMPLES OF THOSE CASES THAT BASED ON YOUR EXPERIENCE, WHAT THEY HAVE BEEN EFFECTIVE IN, IN, IN GETTING DEVELOPMENT. SO I'D LIKE TO SEE THAT. SURE. ALL RIGHT. THANK YOU. THANK YOU, MR. MAYOR PRO TEM, LET ME SAY THIS ALSO THAT FROM MY AREA WHERE I'M SITTING, I CAN SEE WHEN COUNCIL PUNCHING IN, BUT I DON'T WANT US TO GO TOO LONG WITHOUTOMMISSION. YOU MAY HAVE QUESTIONS ALSO. SO IF THAT BE THE CASE YOU MAY JUST WANT TO. YEAH GO TO THE COUNCIL FIRST. YOU WANT TO DO THAT. GO TO THE COUNCIL FIRST OKAY EVERYONE OKAY WITH THAT. VERY GOOD. ALL RIGHT. COUNCILMAN HEDRICK THANK YOU MAYOR. THANK YOU. MAYOR P PRO TEM COUNCILMAN WILLIAMS TOUCHED UPON IT A LITTLE BIT ABOUT DISTRICT RECOMMENDATIONS. AND YOU SOUND LIKE YOU'RE GOING TO PROVIDE MAYBE SOME OF THOSE. I KNOW OUR SF5 IS OUR SMALLEST, REALLY SINGLE FAMILY ZONING DISTRICT. AND YOU'RE ADVOCATING FOR EVEN SMALLER, MAYBE HALF THAT SIZE EVEN. YEAH. I'M CURIOUS NOT ONLY THE DIFFERENT TYPES OF DISTRICTS, BUT ARE YOU GOING TO PROVIDE REGULATION RECOMMENDATIONS IN THOSE DISTRICTS, LIKE SETBACKS AND MINIMUM OTHER, YOU KNOW, WIDTHS AND THAT KIND OF THING? AUXILIARY DWELLING UNIT REGULATIONS THAT KIND OF MAKE THOSE MORE DEVELOPABLE THAT WE MAY LIKE SOME CRITICAL FACTORS ASSOCIATED WITH EACH OF THOSE. YES. WE DON'T HAVE A FULL ON LIKE ZONING DIAGNOSTIC IN THIS SCOPE, WHICH IS WHAT I WOULD CALL THAT. BUT THERE ARE SOME THINGS THAT WE'VE SEEN FROM DIFFERENT KIND OF DEVELOPMENTS IN DIFFERENT PLACES THAT WE CAN SAY HERE, HERE ARE THE THINGS THAT ARE IMPORTANT TO CERTAIN TYPES OF DEVELOPMENT. BUT, YOU KNOW, YOU MENTIONED THE REDUCTION IN LOT SIZE. WE WENT THROUGH A PROCESS SIMILAR TO THIS IN NEW BRAUNFELS LAST YEAR. THEY'RE GETTING READY. THEY'RE GOING THROUGH THEY'RE WORKING ON A CODE UPDATE RIGHT NOW KIND OF AS THEY GO TO CHANGE SOME STUFF. THEY'RE DOING A COMP PLAN UPDATE LATER THIS YEAR, BUT THEY'VE ALREADY CREATED A 2500, 2500 SQUARE FOOT LOT SIZE. AND THEY'RE TRYING TO CREATE ONE THAT WILL GO DOWN TO 800FTā– S. AD THEN PARKING MINIMUMS IS ANOTHER ONE. THEY'RE WORKING AT BLOWING AWAY PARKING MINIMUMS AS WELL. BUT BUT YEAH, THERE'S SOME THINGS THAT HAVE TO HAPPEN TO MAKE SMALL DEVELOPMENT WORK THAT NEED TO BE IN PLACE AS WELL. SO AT LEAST AT A HIGH LEVEL OF THINGS THAT WE CAN RECOMMEND OR RECOMMEND OR SHARE FROM OTHER PLACES, WE'LL SHARE THAT. AND THEN MORE SPECIFICS WOULD BE PART OF THE NEXT STEP OF THE ZONING, DIAGNOSTIC AND WHATEVER CODE UPDATES WOULD COME AFTER THIS. THAT'S GREAT. YEAH. AND I KNOW I'D BE INTERESTED IN SEEING ALL THE DETAILS OF YOUR PRESENTATION. I KNOW CITY MANAGER RICK AND I TALKED, AND HE HAD TO REEL YOU BACK IN FROM WHAT YOU WANTED TO PRESENT. SO I'D LOVE TO DIG INTO ALL THOSE DETAILS AND SEE WHAT YOU HAVE. YEAH, WELL, AND WE KNEW WE WERE GOINGO HAVE TO REEL IT BACK FOR, FOR THIS ONE. BUT WE'RE TRYING TO GET WE WANTED TO GET STAFF THE, THE CONTEXT TO LOOK AT FIRST SOMETIMES, SOMETIMES I'VE BEEN ASKED TO SCALE THIS DOWN TO LIKE A 10 OR 15 MINUTE PRESENTATION AND YOU JUST HAVE TO HIT THE HIGHLIGHTS AND THEN EVERYBODY'S LIKE, OH, THE SKY IS FALLING. BUT THERE'S NO EXPLANATION TO WHY. SO I APPRECIATE THE PATIENCE TO LET ME GET THROUGH THE KEY DETAILS WITHOUT ALL THE DETAILS. BUT YEAH, IF YOU WANT TO SEE THE WHOLE THING, IT'S ALL THERE. I APPRECIATE YOUR HARD WORK ON IT.

YEAH. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. THANK YOU. THANK YOU, MAYOR PRO TEM. THANK YOU SIR. COUNCIL LADY LUCK. LADY LUCK. ONE OF THE SLIDES THAT YOU THAT YOU SHOWED US HAD RIDGEWOOD SHOPPING CENTER

[01:05:01]

IN IT. ONE OF THOSE OLD MID-CENTURY SIGNS THAT WE'RE ACTUALLY LOOKING AT TRYING TO PRESERVE. MY POINT IS, THERE ARE SEVERAL SHOPPING CENTERS JUST LIKE THAT ON KINGSLEY ROAD, ORCHARD HILLS, AND THEY'RE ON BOTH SIDES. SO I REALLY WANT TO KNOW WHAT YOUR RECOMMENDATION IS TO DEAL WITH THE COMMERCIAL PROPERTY OWNERS THAT HAVE THAT OWN THE ENTIRE SHOPPING CENTER.

AND WE'RE JUST WE FEEL LIKE WE'RE JUST NOT ABLE TO DO ANYTHING THERE BECAUSE OF THEIR LACK OF WILLINGNESS TO EITHER COOPERATE OR OR REALLY EVEN COMMUNICATE IN ANY WAY. SO, AND I DON'T EXPECT YOU TO BE ABLE TO ANSWER THAT TONIGHT, BUT I DO. I AM REALLY OPEN TO SO MANY. I'M OPEN TO ANYTHING TO KIND OF GET THINGS MOVING IN PLACES LIKE THAT. I DON'T FEEL LIKE THE CITY SHOULD HAVE TO PAY FOR EVERYTHING TO BE DONE IN A SHOPPING CENTER IN ORDER FOR THE PROPERTY OWNER TO SAY, OKAY, I'LL PARTICIPATE, YOU KNOW? YEAH, I SO DON'T HAVE ALL OF THE ANSWERS YET. WE ARE TALKING ABOUT IT. TONY'S LOOKING AT IT. MANI MANI AND I TWO WEEKENDS AGO SPENT ABOUT THREE HOURS CRUISING AROUND DOWNTOWN LOOKING AT THOSE. WE WERE LOOKING AT THOSE PROPERTIES THAT WERE IN THE DOWNTOWN RFP. AND THEN WE ALSO WENT AND LOOKED AT A FEW OF THESE. AND I'VE BEEN REALLY PICKING HIS BRAIN FOR LIKE, WHAT? WHAT CAN WE PUT INTO A PACKAGE THAT WOULD EXPLAIN TO THESE FOLKS THAT THEY YES, THEY'RE GETTING MAILBOX MONEY.

YES, THEY'RE GETTING MONEY, THEY'RE MAKING SOME MONEY. BUT WITH JUST A LITTLE BIT OF EXTRA, THEY COULD MAKE A LOT MORE AND THE CITY COULD MAKE A LOT MORE. RIGHT. WE HAVE TO FIGURE OUT THAT RIGHT, THAT RIGHT MESSAGE. AND YOU'RE STILL NOT GOING TO YOU'RE STILL NOT GOING TO GET EVERYBODY TO BITE. BUT YOU KNOW THE WHEATLAND ONE THAT MONTY'S WORKING IN THAT WE HAVE OUR OFFICE IN WITH HIM NOW THAT ONE SAT DOING THE EXACT SAME THING THAT Y'ALLS ARE DOING FOR TEN YEARS. AND THE CITY TRIED AND THEY TRIED AND THEY TRIED. MONTY PITCHED A COUPLE TIMES IF HE WANTED TO COME IN AND DO IT, AND THEY SAID NO. AND THEN THEY FINALLY, AFTER A COUPLE MORE YEARS OF IT NOT HAPPENING, THEY SAID, YES, LET'S DO THIS. AND NOW IT'S ALREADY BUMPING ON THE TAX ROLLS. AND IT'S JUST, YOU KNOW, WE'RE WORKING ON I THINK I TOLD SOME OF Y'ALL ON THE TOUR, WE'RE WORKING ON THE TOWNHOMES RIGHT IN THE MIDDLE OF THE PARKING LOT. RIGHT NOW. WE HAVE TO FIND SOME PEOPLE LOCALLY THAT WANT TO DO THAT KIND OF THING AND SEE IF WE CAN GET THAT TRANSACTION. EITHER GIVE THE PERSON THERE THE OPPORTUNITY TO DO IT, OR FIND SOMEONE LOCALLY, OR A GROUP OF PEOPLE THAT MIGHT BE WILLING TO DO ENOUGH TO MAKE THAT TRANSACTION HAPPEN. THERE'S NO GUARANTEES. I MEAN, YOU CAN'T FORCE ANYBODY TO DO SOMETHING. BUT WE THINK IF WE CAN SHOW A COUPLE OF EXAMPLES OF SOME OF THE INCREMENTAL STUFF, IT CAN GET THEM TO ACT A LOT OF TIMES SOME SOME OF THE FOLKS THAT, THAT I KNOW THAT THAT HAVE SOME OF THESE, THEY, THEY THINK THAT THE CITIES AND RIGHTFULLY SO, THEY THINK THAT THE EXPECTATION IS YOU'RE GOING TO GO HIT A HOME RUN, YOU'RE GOING TO TAKE IT FROM THIS ONE STORY THING TO A FIVE STORY URBAN VILLAGE. AND THAT SCARES THEM. THEY HAVEN'T DONE THAT. THEY HAVEN'T DONE ANYTHING AT THAT LEVEL. THEY DON'T THINK THEY CAN GET THE FINANCING AT THAT LEVEL. THAT'S A LOT OF WORK. THAT'S A DIFFERENT TYPE OF DEVELOPER THAN SOMEBODY THAT'S OWNED AND OPERATING A SHOPPING CENTER LIKE THIS RIGHT NOW. BUT THE INCREMENTAL STUFF IS SOMETHING THAT THEY MIGHT DO. SO ONE OF THE THINGS TONY'S TALKING WITH IS SOME OF THE INTERVIEWS THAT HE'S DOING IS ASKING, FILLING OUT KIND OF THAT SCALE OF WOULD YOU BE OPEN TO, YOU KNOW, TO SOMETHING A LITTLE MORE INCREMENTALLY, AND SOMETIMES IT JUST MIGHT BE IF IT'S A SITE THAT WE THAT WE SEE WITH THE DATA AND THE ANALYSIS AND ENGAGEMENT THAT LIKE THIS HAS TO BE A SCRAPE AND REDEVELOP OR SOMETHING BIGGER THEN THERE'S GOING TO BE, THERE'S IF IT'S THAT IMPORTANT, IT COMES BACK TO INCENTIVES. THERE'S GOING TO HAVE TO BE SOMETHING WHERE THE DOLLAR AMOUNT IS ENOUGH, THAT YOU GET THEM TO MOVE. AND SOMETIMES THAT MEANS SPENDING TOO MUCH. BUT I MEAN THAT THAT ALSO COMES DOWN TO THE CITY HAVING DISCIPLINE WITH I MEAN, AT SOME POINT YOU'RE SPENDING MORE THAN IT MAKES SENSE TO DO SO. BUT THERE ARE STRATEGIES. I THINK WE JUST GOT TO PITCH IT THE RIGHT WAY AND SEE IF WE CAN GET SOME OF THEM TO KIND OF COME OUT OF THEIR SHELL A LITTLE BIT.

I WOULD LOVE TO SEE THAT. I ALSO WAS REALLY INTERESTED IN THAT SLIDE WHERE YOU WERE TALKING ABOUT STREET W WIDTH AND BRINGIG THE FACADE OF BUILDINGS CLOSER TO THE STREET AND ELIMINATING A LOT OF THE PARKING IN FRONT OF IT. YES, THAT ONE. I, I WOULD LIKE TO SEE A RECOMMENDATION FOR AN AREA WHERE YOU WHERE YOU THINK THAT SOMETHING LIKE THIS WOULD BE SUCCESSFUL. I THINK THAT WOULD BE VERY INTERESTING TO EXPERIMENT WITH. IT IS, YOU KNOW, LAND USE AND

[01:10:04]

TRANSPORTATION GO TOGETHER. I WILL SAY SOME SOME TIMES ON THE LEFT SIDE OF THAT GRAPHIC, IT'S THE PRIVATE SIDE, RIGHT ON THE RIGHT SIDE OF THAT GRAPHIC, IT'S THE PUBLIC REALM. IT'S THE RIGHT OF WAY THAT THE CITY CONTROLS. SOMETIMES YOU START IT BY CHANGING THE CITY CHANGES THE STREET, AND THEN THE PRIVATE SIDE FOLLOWS. SOMETIMES THE RIGHT PRIVATE SIDE WILL LEAD WITH SOME KIND OF GUARANTEE FROM THE CITY THAT IF WE DO THIS AND WE BUILD THIS STREETSCAPE STUFF OUT HERE IN FRONT, THAT'S NOT GOING TO WORK FOR US. IF YOU CONTINUE TO HAVE A BUNCH OF HIGH SPEED TRAVEL LANES IN FRONT OF US. SO IT GOES. IT HAS TO WORK TOGETHER. AND ZOOMING OUT, LOOKING AT THE MAP, WHERE WHERE ARE THE CORRIDORS THAT MAKES YOU CAN'T DO THIS ONE BLOCK AT A TIME. SO WHERE ARE THE CORRIDORS THAT THIS MAKES SENSE TO REALLY LOOK AT DOING. AND YOU HAVE YOU HAVE SOME JUST ON THE SURFACE. BUT WE STILL HAVE TO WORK WITH, WITH PAUL AND ALL THE ENGINEERING AND MICHAEL AND THE ENGINEERING FOLKS AND SEE WHAT ARE THE TRAFFIC COUNTS AND WHERE, WHERE DOES IT MAYBE MAKE SENSE TO LOOK AT SOME OF THESE? BUT THAT'S PART OF REDEVELOPMENT AND INFILL AND GOING TO THE NEXT LEVEL OF A MORE URBANIZED COMMUNITY IS WHERE WHERE ARE PLACES THAT YOU DROP A LANE AND REPLACE THAT WITH BIKE WALK, WALKABLE, MIXED USE. AND YOU'VE DEFINITELY GOT SOME PLACES THAT ARE AT LEAST WORTH A LOOK. THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR ALL THE WORK THAT YOU'VE DONE, AND I'M REALLY EXCITED TO JUST DIG DEEPER INTO EVERYTHING AND SEE WHAT YOU BRING, BECAUSE IT'S BEEN EYE OPENING. AND I THINK THAT I THINK EVERYONE UNDERSTANDS WHAT YOU'RE SAYING. AND, AND THAT'S IMPORTANT BECAUSE THESE ARE VERY COMPLEX ISSUES AND DIFFICULT TO UNDERSTAND. SO THANK YOU SO MUCH. OKAY. I DON'T HAVE ANYONE IN THE QUEUE. SO THAT SAYS THAT IT'S I CAN SAY SOMETHING AT THIS POINT AS IT RELATES TO. IS THERE A PIECE IN HERE THAT HAS ANYTHING TO DO WITH MINDSET? MOST OF EVERYTHING THAT I'VE HEARD SO FAR HAS TO DO WITH IF WE MAKE THINGS SMALLER, THEN WHAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN THERE IS WE WILL INCREASE REVENUE AND INCREASE DENSITY. AND I THINK THAT THOSE ARE VERY IMPORTANT. BUT IN MY WORLD IT SEEMS THAT MOST PEOPLE DON'T SEE SMALLER BEING BETTER. THAT'S ONE OF THE REASONS THAT THEY DO HAVE LARGER HOMES THAT WE DO HAVE. AND I'M JUST WONDERING NOW, IS THERE WHAT PIECE, HOW DO WE CHANGE MINDSET IN ORDER TO DEAL WITH SOME OF THE CREATIVE AND INNOVATIVE PROGRESSIVE KINDS OF THOUGHTS THAT YOU ARE PRESENTING PRESENTLY? I IT'S A GREAT QUESTION, AND IT'S A CHALLENGE THAT WE HAVE EVERYWHERE THAT WE'RE WORKING IN TEXAS, ESPECIALLY. AND PART OF, YOU KNOW, IF I WAS TALKING TO SOMEBODY ONE ON ONE, PART OF WHAT I EXPLAIN IS MY PERSONAL STORY THAT Y'ALL HEARD AT THE START OF THIS. BUT WHAT I SAW WORKING NATIONALLY IN PLACES THAT WERE FURTHER ALONG IN THE DEVELOPMENT CURVE AND CHANGES THEY HAD, THEY WERE FORCED TO MAKE OUT OF MORE DESPERATION BECAUSE THEY COULDN'T COULDN'T KEEP THE WATER ON OR COULD, YOU KNOW, WHATEVER, WHATEVER THAT THAT WAS, WE ULTIMATELY WHAT THIS IS ABOUT IS ALIGNING EXPECTATIONS. SO IF SOMEONE WHICH THE BASE IN A LOT OF TEXAS IS LARGER, LOTS AUTO CENTRIC IS WHAT THEY WANT. ALL WE'RE SAYING IS THAT'S FINE, BUT YOU GOT TO PAY MORE FOR IT, BECAUSE WHAT YOU'RE PAYING RIGHT NOW IS NOT ENOUGH TO PAY FOR THAT LOT SIZE, THAT HOME SIZE, THAT LIFESTYLE, WHATEVER IT'S. I GAVE THAT ANALOGY EARLY ON OF LIKE BUYING THE CAR. IF I JUST GO TO SOMEONE AND SAY, WHAT KIND OF CAR DO YOU WANT? THEY MIGHT S ANYTHING. BUT IF I SAY YOU'RE MARRIED, YOU MAKE $100,000, YOU HAVE TWO KIDS AND YOU LIVE 45 MINUTES FROM WORK. NOW, WHAT KIND OF CAR? YOU CAN BUY DIFFERENT CONVERSATION, RIGHT? WE'RE NOT HAVING THAT CONVERSATION WITH THE KIND OF HOMES PEOPLE ARE BUYING IN THE WAY THAT WE'RE LIVING. IT'S, OH, DON'T RAISE MY TAXES. AND OH MY GOSH, YOU'RE TRYING TO RAISE MY WATER RATES AND I CAN'T AFFORD IT. AND YOU KNOW, I WANT TO DRIVE EVERYWHERE AND I DON'T WANT TO DRIVE IN TRAFFIC. SO ADD ANOTHER LANE. BUT THE OTHER SIDE OF THE EQUATION I WOULD, I WOULD FLIP THAT AND CHALLENGE YOU GUYS AS CITY LEADERS. YOU'VE GOT TO PUSH THE OTHER SIDE OF THE EQUATION OF EQUATION OF HOW ARE WE GOING TO PAY FOR IT. THAT'S FINE. MR. MR. MRS. SMITH WHATEVER. THAT'S FINE THAT YOU WANT THAT, BUT YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE TO PAY FOR THAT. AND, AND WE PART OF THIS PROCESS IS WE HAVE TO SET THAT AT THAT UNDERSTANDING THAT IN EIGHT YEARS THERE'S A LOT THERE'S A BIG GAP AND IT'S GOING TO START TO COME SOONER THAN THAT. THERE'S A GAP THAT HAS TO BE MADE UP, AND WE CAN TRY TO DO IT WITH DEVELOPMENT AND GET SOME SOME DENSITY AND SOME INFILL AND SOME REDEVELOPMENT IN CERTAIN PLACES, NOT EVERYWHERE. AND I'M NOT PITCHING HUGE DENSITY. I THINK INCREMENTAL SMALL STUFF CITYWIDE GETS YOU WHERE YOU NEED TO GO. AND A LOT OF TIMES WHEN YOU SHOW PEOPLE PICTURES OF IT, IT'S NOT SCARY, BUT IT'S EITHER WE NEED SOME DENSITY AND SOME PLACES TO INCREASE THE TAXABLE

[01:15:06]

VALUE, OR WE'RE GOING TO NEED TO GET THAT ADDITIONAL REVENUE THROUGH BUMPING YOUR TAX RATE, TAKING IT TO A VOTE AND RAISING THE TAX RATE. AND THE BIGGER CHALLENGE I SEE IN THE REGION IS THE CAPACITY THE PEOPLE HAVE, WHAT THEY'RE ACTUALLY WILLING AND ABLE TO PAY FOR IS, YOU KNOW, THEY MIGHT HAVE BEEN ABLE TO AFFORD A 3000 SQUARE FOOT HOME ON A HALF ACRE LOT WHEN IT WAS 200,000, BUT WITH PROPERTY VALUES GOING UP NOW IT'S 400,000 AND THEY'RE THEY'RE TAPPED OUT, RIGHT WHERE WHEN PROPERTY VALUES, WHEN LAND VALUES, PROPERTY VALUES CONTINUE TO GO UP, WHICH WITHOUT MORE HOUSING, THEY'RE GOING TO WHERE ARE THEY GOING TO GO. AND WE DON'T. THE REGIONAL CONVERSATION IS WE DON'T HAVE ENOUGH HOUSING, PERIOD FOR EVERYBODY TO GO THAT'S MOVING HERE. SO WE NEED A LOT MORE HOUSING, AND WE CAN EITHER BUILD IT OUT TO OKLAHOMA IN A SPREAD OUT FASHION, WHICH TAKES MORE WATER AND ROADS AND EVERYTHING ELSE, OR WE CAN START TO GET A LITTLE, A LITTLE DENSER. SO I WOULD JUST SAY THE CONVERSATION ALWAYS HAS TO COME BACK TO HOW ARE WE GOING TO PAY FOR IT? HOW ARE WE THE CITY GOING TO PAY FOR IT? HOW ARE YOU THE RESIDENT, GOING TO PAY FOR IT? AND WE GOT TO FIND THAT. WE'VE GOT TO FIND THAT BALANCE.

IT'S A HARD CONVERSATION, BUT IT HAS TO START. YEAH. THE PSYCHOLOGY JUST SEEMS TO IT'S.

YEAH. AND THE BISHOP ARTS AREA, FOR EXAMPLE, I'M SURE THAT THEY HAD THESE CONVERSATIONS EARLY ON. BUT YOU AND I CAN BOTH AGREE THAT, YOU KNOW, I WAS RAISED OVER IN OAK CLIFF. SO, BISHOP ARTHUR ALL BUT GONE BEFE THEY WERE ABLE TO IMPLEMENT SOME OF THE TYPES OF THINGS THAT YOU'RE SPEAKING OF TODAY. AND YOU'RE RIGHT, THE GROWTH AT THIS POINT IS PHENOMENAL. IT'S JUST TREMENDOUS. SO IT'S INTERESTING LIKE, I MEAN, MEMPHIS HAS PLACES LIKE THIS, KANSAS CITY HAS PLACES LIKE THIS THAT THEY THEY GOT JUST REALLY, REALLY LIKE DESPERATEIKE THINGS WERE. AND THEN ALL OF A SUDDEN ALL THESE INNOVATIVE, YOU START TO LIKE SAY, WELL, WE HAVE NO CHOICE BUT TO BREAK THE RULES SO THAT THAT MINIMUM LOT SIZE DOESN'T MATTER ANYMORE. SOUTH BEND. RIGHT. IT'S LIKE IT GETS TO A POINT THAT WE HAVE TO DO SOMETHING. THE RULES GO OUT, AND THEN ALL OF A SUDDEN THESE GREAT THINGS HAPPEN AND IT HAPPENS FAST. AND THEN EVERYBODY WANTS TO BE A PART OF IT AND IT GENTRIFIES. SO THAT'S THE FLIP SIDE IS IF YOU DO THIS WELL WITH WHAT HAPPENED IN BISHOP ARTS, THAT EXAMPLE I GAVE OF, YOU KNOW, 480,000 TO 900,000, THAT'S GENTRIFICATION. THAT'S THE DEFINITION OF GENTRIFICATION. RIGHT. BUT THAT'S BISHOP ARTS TODAY IS A COMPLETELY DIFFERENT SET OF PEOPLE THAN WHAT IT WAS WHEN IT STARTED. AND A LOT OF THE FOLKS WHEN IT STARTED WOULD HAVE LOVED TO STAY THERE. THAT'S PART OF A CODE THING. ONE OF THE THINGS THAT THAT I'VE LEARNED MONEY AND I TALK ABOUT IS SOMETHING THAT WE CALL PUT A LID ON IT. IF YOU IF YOU WANT REDEVELOPMENT TO HAPPEN IN A BROADER AREA, YOU LIMIT THE STORIES SO THAT YOU SPREAD THAT DEMAND OUT OVER A BIGGER AREA, AS OPPOSED TO LETTING THAT DEMAND GO INTO A SMALLER AREA OF TALLER BUILDINGS. RIGHT. DOES THAT MAKE SENSE? YES, SIR. I MEAN, BISHOP ARTS DIDN'T DO THAT. SO ALL THE DEMAND GOT FOCUSED IN A REALLY SMALL AREA VERSUS IF YOU HAD LIMITED IT TO MAX THREE STORIES, YOU SPREAD THAT OUT OVER A MUCH BIGGER A MUCH BIGGER AREA. THANK YOU SIR, I'M GOING TO ALLOW YOU TO GO AHEAD. YEAH. COMMISSIONERS, WE'LL START OVER HERE, COMMISSIONER DALTON, THANK YOU. IN YOUR REVIEWS, HAVE YOU TAKEN INTO ACCOUNT THE AGING OUT? EXCUSE ME, DO WE HAVE A MICROPHONE DOWN THERE? YEAH. TURN YOUR MIC ON, PLEASE, IF YOU DON'T. NOT VERY LOUD. OKAY? OKAY. LET ME DO THIS BETTER. THERE YOU GO. OKAY. IN YOUR RESEARCH, HAVE YOU TAKEN INTO ACCOUNT AGING OUT WHERE YOU HAVE RESIDENTIAL PROPERTIES, ESPECIALLY WHERE THE TAXES ARE FROZEN, THE TAX REVENUE TO THE CITY IS NOT THE TAXABLE VALUE OF THE PROPERTY. AND THAT CAUSES A LOT OF DOLLAR SHORTAGE. AND WHAT WOULD BE THE EFFECT OF IMPROVEMENT IF THESE HOUSES WERE TO GET SOLD AND MOVED ON TO THE NEXT OWNER? BECAUSE IT'S NOT JUST THE AGING OUT, IT'S THE LACK OF THE FAMILY IN THE HOUSE. YOU HAVE A STRUCTURE, BUT YOU'VE ONLY GOT 1 OR 2 PEOPLE INSTEAD OF FOUR KIDS AND THREE CARS AND SCHOOL SUPPLIES AND CLOTHES THAT GET BOUGHT AND TAXES GET COLLECTED. EXCELLENT QUESTION. YES, SO WE HAVEN'T LOOKED AT IT YET, ALTHOUGH THE WHEN WE DO THAT PROPERTY TAX REVENUE, THAT'S THE ACTUAL REVENUE THAT THE CITY GETS. SO THAT IS AFTER EXEMPTIONS WHETHER IT'S HOMESTEAD OR, OR CAPS OR ANYTHING ELSE. ONE OF. I AM NOT WELL PERSONALLY I LOVE THE PROPERTY TAX CAP. AS A

[01:20:08]

CONSULTANT ON WHAT WE DO, IT WAS IT'S GOING TO BE CHALLENGING. LOOK AT ANY OTHER STATE THAT PUT TAX CAPS IN PLACE. YEARS AGO CALIFORNIA, LAS VEGAS, WASHINGTON STATE. THEY ARE ALL TRYING TO GET OUT OF IT NOW BECAUSE THEY DID IT TO ATTRACT THE GROWTH IN THE SHORT TERM.

AND NOW THEIR PEERS 30 LATER, 30 YEARS LATER ARE LIKE, WHY DID YOU GIVE ALL THAT MONEY AWAY? AND IT LOCKS PEOPLE IN TO WHERE BECAUSE OF THE CAPS, THEY HAVE A REALLY GOOD DEAL. AND EVEN IF THEY WANTED TO SELL AND MOVE, IF THEY GO TRY TO MOVE EVEN TO A COMPARABLE PLACE AND HAVE TO PAY MARKET VALUE. IT'S SUCH A BIG BUMP. IT LOCKS PEOPLE IN AND SO PEOPLE CAN'T MOVE IN THE HOUSING MARKET LIKE THEY USED TO. WE THAT'S ONE OF THE THINGS THAT WE HAVE TO LOOK AT IS WHERE ARE THOSE EXEMPTIONS AND WHAT IF THEY FLIP AND YOU JUST GOT YOU JUST GOT THE REAL VALUE. WHAT DOES THAT DO? ANOTHER PART OF THAT CONVERSATION IN SOME PLACES IS THE PEOPLE THAT ARE IN THAT HOME. IF YOU HAD SOME CODE CHANGES AND YOU COULD SAY YOU HAVE A WIDOW THAT'S LIVING IN A HOME BY HERSELF, YOU KNOW, KIDS ARE GONE. WHATEVER. COULD THEY SET IT UP TO CHANGE THAT SINGLE FAMILY HOME TO HAVE A COUPLE OF RENTAL UNITS? THOSE OF YOU THAT CAME TO, I THINK THE CHUCK MARONE, THE HOUSING TRAP CONVERSATION DOWN IN DALLAS WHERE HE WAS TALKING ABOUT SOME OF THE RETROFITTING, SOME OF THOSE HOUSES TO HAVE LIKE A ROOMMATE HOUSE. RIGHT. THAT ALLOWS SOMEONE THAT'S LIVING BY THEMSELVES TO HAVE SOMEONE THAT THEY INTERVIEW AND VET LIVE WITH THEM. IT ACTUALLY THEY PAY RENT. IT GENERATES REVENUE BACK INTO, YOU KNOW, SO THERE'S A LOT OF THINGS THAT OTHER PLACES HAVE LEARNED AND CAN DO THERE THAT WE CAN APPLY HERE TOO. BUT THE CODE HAS TO THE CODE HAS TO ALLOW IT. AND YOU REALLY HAVE TO FLIP THAT MINDSET OF YOU HAVE TO GET BACK TO MULTIGENERATIONAL HOUSING OF LIKE YOU, YOU MIGHT NEED TO HAVE. THE FLIP SIDE OF THAT IS A YOUNG COUPLE OR MID, YOU KNOW, GEN X, BEST GENERATION EVER. MOTHER IN LAW, FATHER IN LAW, SOMEONE SOMEONE NEEDS TO COME BACK HOME, RIGHT? AND THEY DON'T NEED TO BE IN THE ASSISTED LIVING, BUT YOU DON'T WANT THEM UNDER YOUR ROOF. IF WE CAN DO THE ACCESSORY DWELLING UNIT OR HAVE A LOCK OFF ROOM OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT TO KIND OF REPURPOSE SOME OF THOSE HOMES, YOU CAN GET ADDITIONAL VALUE THAT WAY. SO THERE ARE STRATEGIES THERE THAT ARE GOING TO BE PUTN THE TABLE HERE, AND IT'S GOING TO COME DOWN TO WHAT, YOU KNOW WHAT YOU GUYS, WHAT KIND OF RULES DO YOU WANT TO HAVE IN PLACE HERE. BUT JUST THAT TRANSACTION, THAT TRANSACTION OF HOMES, THAT IS WE CAN'T WE CAN'T ASSUME THAT EVERYWHERE. BUT YOU CAN YOU CAN ASSUME A PERCENTAGE OF THOSE SOMETHING'S GOING TO HAPPEN IN THE NEXT FIVE YEARS OR TEN YEARS SOMETHING. AND, AND AT LEAST START TO ESTIMATE WHAT KIND OF IMPACT WE'LL HAVE. OKAY. BUT WE HAVE NOT DONE THAT YET. ANOTHER THOUGHT, ANOTHER QUESTION. I HA. PART OF YOUR PRESENTATION DISCUSSES MIXED USE DEVELOPMENT AND HOW GOOD THAT IS FOR THE REVENUE STREAM OF THE CITY.

THERE'S BEEN MORE THAN ONE DEVELOPMENT AREA, NOT A DEVELOPMENT, BUT AN AREA THAT WE'VE GONE IN AND REZONED. THIS COMMISSION IS REZONE THIS COUNCIL FOR MIXED USE DOWN THE ROAD A YEAR, TWO YEARS, THREE YEARS. THE NEXT THING WE KNOW IS THE FOURTH OR FIFTH. EXCUSE ME, DEVELOPER COMES TO US WITH MULTIFAMILY. WE STILL DON'T HAVE A DEPARTMENT STORE. WE STILL DON'T HAVE A RESTAURANT, BUT WE GET PLENTY OF APARTMENTS. WE CAN'T SEEM TO DRAW THAT MULTI USE TIDBIT TO THE BIGGER PICTURE. I CAN THINK OF A COUPLE OF LOCATIONS IN SPECIFICS THAT WE ACTUALLY HAD SET UP AS MIXED USE, AND RIGHT NOW THEY'RE ALL APARTMENTS. IS THERE A WAY A SOLUTION WE CAN DRAW THESE PEOPLE IN? I'D HAVE TO LOOK AT IT CASE BY CASE. MY GUT IS YOU WENT TOO BIG BECAUSE SOMETIMES. THE COMMERCIAL NEEDS THE PEOPLE, RIGHT. AND SO SOMETIMES TO GET THE GROCERY STORE OR THE BIG ANCHOR TENANT, THEY NEED A CERTAIN NUMBER OF PEOPLE IN THAT AREA FIRST. SO WITH MIXED USE, WITH ANY MIXED USE, MOST DEVELOPERS ARE GOING TO SAY WE WANT TO BUILD THE RESIDENTIAL FIRST TO GET THAT DEMAND IN THIS AREA, YOU KNOW, AND THEN THEY'LL COME IN WITH COMMERCIAL. AND SOMETIMES THAT TAKES A WHILE. I'D HAVE TO LOOK AT THE DEVELOPMENT AGREEMENTS. IS THERE SOME KIND OF CLOCK IN THERE IF YOU HAVE TO BUILD X BY X DATE OR THIS MANY UNIT IT THERE'S A LOT OF STRATEGIES YOU CAN PUT INTO DEVELOPMENT AGREEMENTS THERE.

BUT AGAIN THE VALUE I DON'T I DON'T I CAN'T EMPHASIZE THIS ENOUGH FROM SOME OTHER PLACES THAT WERE IN A SIMILAR CONTEXT OF GARLAND, WHERE YOU DIDN'T WANT TO LEAN INTO THE INCREMENTAL APPROACH, AND YOU KIND OF HELD OUT FOR THAT BIGGER DEVELOPMENT TO HAPPEN, AND YOU GOT HALF BAKED STUFF WHERE YOU DIDN'T GET STUFF AT ALL, VERSUS IF YOU GO INCREMENTALLY AND YOU

[01:25:03]

ADD A LITTLE BIT OF A LITTLE BIT OF POPULATION AT A TIME AND A LITTLE BIT OF SMALLER COMMERCIAL, YOU KNOW, LET LET THINGS EVOLVE THE WAY THAT THEY USED TO NATURALLY GO INSTEAD OF TRYING TO GO FROM HERE TO HERE, YOU KNOW, GO FROM ONE STORY TO FIVE STORY, YOU HAVE SOME PLACES THAT HAVE THAT KIND OF JUMP POTENTIAL, BUT YOU HAVE A LOT OF PLACES THAT ARE REALLY PRIMED FOR THE INCREMENTAL AND JUST DON'T I DON'T WANT I DON'T WANT TO SIT HERE LIKE FIVE YEARS FROM NOW FROM GARLAND AND SEE ALL IS ONE OF THOSE PLACES THAT HAD PEOPLE OR HAD OPPORTUNITIES TO START ON SOMETHING RIGHT NOW AND DO SOME THINGS INCREMENTALLY. AND YOU DIDN'T EMBRACE THAT, OR THE DEVELOPER DIDN'T WANT TO DO THAT. AND SO YOU SIT AND YOU SIT AND FIVE YEARS LATER, YOU STILL HAVE THE SHOPPING CENTER SITTING THERE DOING NOTHING, YOU KNOW, OR THEY'RE STILL TRYING TO GET FINANCING TO BUILD THE WHOLE THING ALL AT ONCE VERSUS BUILDING THE FIRST BUILDING, YOU KNOW. SO YEAH, A LOT OF IT, A LOT OF IT WITH THAT IS DO IT AT THE RIGHT SCALE. A LOT OF IT IS MAKING SURE THERE'S A CLOCK IN THERE FOR HOW MANY UNITS HAVE TO BE BUILT IN A, IN A A CERTAIN AMOUNT OF TIME. THERE'S A LOT OF STRATEGIES THERE, BUT I DON'T KNOW WITHOUT SEEING SPECIFIC ONES AND KNOWING THE HISTORY, I DON'T KNOW EXACTLY. YOU KNOW EXACTLY WHAT IT IS. BUT BUT IT HAS TO YOU HAVE TO HAVE THAT, THAT WHOLE SCALE OF, OF INCREMENT DOING THINGS INCREMENTAL, AND YOU HAVE TO HAVE THE WHOLE SCALE OF SIZE. AND YOU DO HAVE TO UNDERSTAND JUST USUALLY THE RESIDENTIAL HAS TO COME FIRST BEFORE THE COMMERCIAL IS GOING TO. YEAH.

THANK YOU. WHICH THE RESIDENTS AND CITIZENS DON'T ALWAYS UNDERSTAND. THEY THINK THE GROCERY STORE SHOULD COME FIRST AND THEN EVERYBODY WILL. BUT THAT'S THAT'S WHAT WE HEAR A LOT. THANK YOU. COMMISSIONERS. OKAY. COMMISSIONER PARIS. YEAH, YEAH. THANK YOU. AND THANK YOU.

IS KEVIN RIGHT? THANK YOU FOR TAKING US THROUGH A LOT OF THE CONTENT, A LOT TO DIGEST. I WILL ADMIT, THERE WAS A SLIDE ON ZONING ANALYSIS CHART, AND I JUST COULDN'T GRASP THE TAKE AWAY FROM IT. I THINK WE KIND OF COVERED IT PRETTY QUICKLY. BUT IS THERE A KEY TAKEAWAY FROM THE ANALYSIS THAT YOU DID WITH THE ZONING? I THINK, YOU KNOW, I DON'T KNOW, I'LL SAY I DON'T KNOW RIGHT OFF TOP HAND WHAT EACH OF THOSE ABBREVIATIONS ARE FOR EVERY ZONING, EVERY ZONING DISTRICT. BUT LOOKING, YOU KNOW, JUST LOOKING AT THE ONES THAT ARE NEGATIVE, WHICH ONES ARE THOSE AND WHY IT'S REALLY BEHIND THIS. THERE'S MORE CHARTS THAT SHOW WITHIN EACH ZONING DISTRICT BY LOT SIZE. AND THAT'S REALLY WHERE WE CAN START TO SEE NOW SOME OF THESE YOUR SF7 SF10.

THOSE ARE, THOSE ARE SINGLE FAMILY TIED TO THE SIZE OF THE LOT. SO THOSE ARE EASY TO UNDER TO UNDERSTAND. SO TO, YOU KNOW, MULTIFAMILY SOME OF THOSE WE CAN SEE. BUT USUALLY THIS IS THE KIND OF INFORMATION THAT WE CAN GO IN AND SAY, START MAKING THE CASE FOR 5000 SQUARE FOOT LOTS MAKES SENSE, OR 2500, OR YOU NEED MORE DUPLEXES OR, YOU KNOW, THINGS LIKE THAT. SO JUST SHOWING THE SUMMARY, NOT A WHOLE LOT I COULD SAY FROM THIS ONE WITHOUT REALLY DIVING INTO THE MORE DETAILED STUFF. AND THAT'S ONE OF THE NEXT STEPS THAT WE'LL BE DOING WITH STAFF. THANK YOU.

OVER ON THIS SIDE. ANY ANYBODY. SURE. COMMISSIONER DUCKWORTH. CAN YOU HEAR ME? YES. ALL RIGHT.

THANK YOU. I'M GOING TO GO BACK IN HISTORY. MANY, MANY YEARS AGO, I CHAIRED A COMMITTEE CALL MAIN STREET GARLAND, WHICH WE ATTEMPTED TO STOP GARLAND, THE DOWNTOWN AREA FROM FROM SINKING IN THE SINKING SAND. AND PART OF THE CHALLENGE, WE AND OUR CITY STAFF DOES A GOOD JOB. BUT ONE OF THE THINGS THAT WE RAN INTO AS A AS A LEAD GROUP IN THAT WAS WHEN SOMEONE CAME TO THE CITY FROM A DEPARTMENT STANDPOINT, THEY HAD TO GO TO THREE DIFFERENT DEPARTMENTS TO GET ALL THE INFORMATION. AND BACK AT THAT TIME, THE CITY MANAGER AND COUNCIL ARRANGED IT SO THAT WHEN WE HAD A CANDIDATE COME INTO THE CITY AND STARTED ASKING ABOUT DOING SOMETHING, PARTICULARLY IN THE DOWNTOWN AREA, THIS WOULD HAVE TO BE THE ENTIRE CITY. BUT HAS HAS ANY OTHER CITIES THAT YOU'VE WORKED WITH? AND I'M SURE ALL OF OUR DEPARTMENTS DO THE BEST JOB THEY CAN, BUT IF WE'VE GOT SOMEBODY THAT COMES TO TOWN AND STARTS ASKING ABOUT ONE PROJECT AND WE FEEL THAT WE COULD HELP THEM MAYBE DO A BETTER JOB INSTEAD OF GOING BIG, GOING SMALLER, TO BE ABLE TO DIRECT THOSE PEOPLE SO THAT WE PULL ALL THE PEOPLE TOGETHER WITH THOSE GROUPS, WITH THAT PERSON OR THAT DEVELOPER TO MAKE IT. LET'S MAKE IT AS EASY AS WE CAN FOR THEM TO DO THE PROJECT AND HAVE YOU. IS THAT SOMETHING YOU SUGGEST OR RECOMMEND TO CITIES IN YOUR PLANS? SO YOU'RE SAYING PULL THE STAFF, THE DIFFERENT DEPARTMENTS TOGETHER

[01:30:01]

SO I CAN MEET? I'M SORRY, I CAN MEET WITH THREE PEOPLE RATHER THAN HAVING TO GO TO THREE DIFFERENT BUILDINGS TO WELL, I CAN'T I MEAN, I CAN'T SPEAK TO THE, THE BUILDINGS AND WHERE EVERYBODY IS, BUT I MEAN, MOST Y'ALL HAVE DRC, Y'ALL HAVE DRC MEETING. YEAH. CALLED A MEETING.

YEAH. SO GARLAND, MOST CITIES NOW HAVE DONE THAT. WHERE YOU HAVE A DEVELOPER, YOU COME IN AND ON THE SITE DEVELOPMENT SIDE OF WHAT WE DO TO YOU COME IN, YOU HAVE A PREDEVELOPMENT MEETING BASICALLY WITH ALL THE DEPARTMENT HEADS THERE. YOU SAY, HERE'S OUR CONCEPT, HERE'S WHAT WE'RE GOING TO DO. YOU KNOW WHAT? WHAT CAN WE DO BY RIGHT. WHAT CHALLENGES ARE WE GOING TO EXPECT? WHAT'S THE PROCESS? DO WE NEED A VARIANCE. ALL OF THOSE THINGS GET ANSWERED UP FRONT. SO THAT'S THAT'S PRETTY COMMON IN MOST PLACES NOW THAT ARE SEEING RAPID, RAPID DEVELOPMENT. THANK YOU. YEAH THAT'S MANDATORY. WE'VE BEEN DOING THAT FOR AT LEAST A DECADE NOW.

COMMISSIONER. IS THERE ANYTHING ELSE? OKAY. WELL NO. YOU GOT SOMETHING. I'M SURE YOU GOT SOMETHING. GO GO GO GO GO GO GO. DON'T LET HIM TALK. YOU'VE GIVEN US A LOT TO THINK ABOUT. YOU REALLY HAVE. AND I LIKE THE GOOD NEWS IN THERE. THAT GARLAND ISN'T IN TERRIBLE SHAPE. I'M SETTING A MEETING WITH SOME MAYORS AND CITY OF FAITH. CITY OF HEATH. 40, 50 YEARS. THEY'RE GOING TO BE SO UPSIDE DOWN. BUT. BUT THE SLIDES, I THINK, WILL BE IMPORTANT. IF WE COULD ARRANGE FOR ALL THE COMMISSIONERS AND THE COUNCIL PEOPLE TO GET A COPY OF THE SLIDES. I THINK ONE COPY OF THE SLIDES THAT YOU SHOWED AND ANOTHER INCLUDING ALL THE BACKUP SLIDES, AND I'M ASSUMING THOSE WILL BE POSTED ON ON THE WEBSITE TO AT LEAST THE PRESENTATION. THIS ONE WILL THE FULL ONE. I DON'T KNOW IF WE'LL POST THAT. NO, NO THAT PROBABLY. BUT I THINK WE'D ALL LIKE TO SEE THAT. AND THERE'S GOING TO BE A LOT OF MANAGING OF EXPECTATIONS IN THIS PROCESS OR QUARTER OF A MILLION PEOPLE HERE. THERE ARE GOING TO BE A QUARTER MILLION EXPECTATIONS TO TRY TO MANAGE.

YOU ONLY TOUCHED ON THE INDUSTRIAL. I THINK WE'RE GOING TO WANT TO SEE SOME RECOMMENDATIONS OF WHAT WE CAN WE DO THERE TO MAKE INDUSTRIAL MORE INVITING, BECAUSE, AGAIN, WE'VE GOT A PRETTY PLAIN INDUSTRIAL. AND AGAIN, I THINK WE PROBABLY WANT TO GO WITH MIXED USE INDUSTRIAL, WHERE THE SERVICES AND THE AREAS ARE THERE FOR THEM. SO HOPEFULLY WE'LL GET SOME RECOMMENDATIONS ON THAT. YEAH, TONY, TONY AND I HAVE TALKED ABOUT SOME. THERE'S SOME PARTS OF INDUSTRIAL THAT ARE DOING REALLY, REALLY WELL AND NEED TO STAY. THERE'S ALSO SOME IDEAS AND EXAMPLES FROM SOME OTHER PLACES THAT ARE OPPORTUNITIES THERE FOR SURE.

GOOD. AND YOU WERE SHOWING SLIDES ABOUT LOT SIZES AND EVERYTHING. WAS THAT FOR RESIDENTIAL ONLY OR DID THAT INCLUDE THE COMMERCIAL WE SO THE FULL DECK HAS ALL OF IT. OKAY.

SO THAT SHOWED I JUST SHOWED A COUPLE OF THE HIGH. YEP. THAT'S WHY 40% OR 39% WAS IN THE 10,000 TO 50,000 AND PLUS. THAT INCLUDED ALL THE INDUSTRIAL TRACKS THEN. YES. SO LET ME GO TO THE ONE. YEAH, YEAH, I THINK, I THINK YOU HAD IT BACK THERE. SO THIS THIS ONE IS ALL PARCELS TOGETHER. OKAY. AND SO THESE, THESE WERE, THIS IS JUST SINGLE FAMILY RESIDENTIAL. THIS IS JUST MULTIFAMILY. BUT THIS IS ALL OF THE DEVELOPED PARCELS IN GARLAND ALL COMBINED. SO INDUSTRIAL COMMERCIAL DOUBLE CHECK ON THAT. AND TO COMMISSIONER DALTON'S QUESTION ABOUT AGING I'VE GOT A DIFFERENT DEAL ON AGING. IS THERE ANY KIND OF ANALYSIS ON THE AGING OF LIKE APARTMENTS? THEY MAY GENERATE REVENUE AT THE BEGINNING, BUT AS THEY DECLINE, THEY START TO REQUIRE MORE SERVICES AND THE REVENUE IS LESS. IS THEIR CUT OFF THEIR OR THEIR STRATEGIES FOR KEEPING THAT UP. SO YES, THERE'S A LOT OF A LOT OF DIFFERENT INFORMATION OUT THERE OF, YOU KNOW, WHERE, WHERE, WHERE WERE APARTMENTS BUILT, WHAT WAS THE QUALITY OF THE CONSTRUCTION? A LOT OF TIMES YOU SEE IN IN YOU DON'T SEE IT AS MUCH TODAY, BUT IN SOME OF THE OLDER APARTMENT COMPLEXES, IT WAS PRETTY LOW IN CONSTRUCTION. THAT WAS JUST IT'S MEANT TO GET THEM IN, GET THE UNITS IN. AND THEN IT'S KIND OF LIKE THE, THE, THE WALMART VERSION OF RESIDENTIAL. IT'S JUST BUILT INTENTIONALLY FOR 20, 30 YEARS. SO LOOKING BACK AT WHEN SOME OF THE THINGS WERE WERE BUILT AS PART OF WHAT WE NEED TO LOOK AT, SOME OF THAT'S IN THE CRITERIA OF, OF MAINTENANCE VERSUS REDEVELOPMENT. IF SOME OF THE BUILDINGS ARE OLDER AND, YOU KNOW, LIKELY TO START NEEDING SIGNIFICANT INVESTMENT, THEN THOSE ARE ALSO, YOU KNOW, THE KIND OF PLACES THAT THEY'RE PAST THE POINT OF ADAPTIVE REUSE. IT'S A IT'S THE RESIDENTIAL VERSION OF BIG EMPTY SHOPPING CENTERS. HOW TO GET THAT REDONE. YES, SIR. A QUESTION I THINK I KNOW THE ANSWER TO THIS ONE. WHEN YOU WERE TALKING ABOUT HOW MUCH MONEY WE NEED AND YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT STREETS, THAT'S ALSO INCLUDING THE WATER AND THE SEWER AND THE REWORKING OF ALL THE UTILITIES IN THAT $14 MILLION. OKAY, THERE'S ANOTHER GAP THERE, FOLKS. THAT IS YOU'RE NOT COUNTING ON THAT. THIS IS JUST STREET THINGS THAT WOULD BE FUNDED, YOU KNOW, DEBT FUNDED CAPITAL IMPROVEMENT PROGRAMS, THE SAME THING THAT WE'RE TALKING IN GENERAL TERMS, THE

[01:35:01]

SAME THING THAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT WITH PROPERTY VALUES AND STREETS. THE SAME THING APPLIES WITH WATER, THE WATER AND SEWER SYSTEM AND YOUR WATER AND SEWER RATES. WHEN YOU WHEN YOU BUILD MORE STUFF, IT'S ULTIMATELY GOING TO START TO TAKE MONEY TO. BUT WHEN YOU FIGURE WE NEED $14 BILLION MORE, THAT MONEY WOULD INCLUDE WHEN WE'RE DOING STREETS, DOES THAT ALSO INCLUDE DOING THE WATER AND THE SEWER UNDERNEATH THEM? IT COULD. IF I THINK THIS IS A QUESTION TO DIG INTO, YOU KNOW, WITH MATT FURTHER, BUT MY UNDERSTANDING IS THAT RIGHT NOW, THE DEBT PORTION FOR THE FIRST FOR THE FORESEEABLE TERM IS FOCUSED ON STREETS AND A LITTLE BIT SOME ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT STUFF AND A LITTLE BIT OF FACILITIES. YOU HAVE FACILITIES AND PARKS THAT ARE COMING. ALSO, YOU MIGHT HAVE SOME OF YOUR WATER AND SEWER THAT'S IN YOUR CAPITAL PROJECTS THAT WOULD BE DEBT FUNDED. BUT A LOT OF THAT YOU'RE GOING TO BE LOOKING AT YOUR WATER AND SEWER RATES, YOU KNOW, TO HELP PAY FOR. SO I DON'T KNOW WHEN THE LAST TIME YOU GUYS EVALUATED YOUR YOUR UTILITY RATES, BUT IT'S THE SAME CONVERSATION OF WE NEED THIS. AND I THOUGHT I KNEW THAT ANSWER, APPARENTLY I DIDN'T. SO THAT'S A FUNDING GAP THAT WE'RE AN EXTRA FUNDING GAP.

WE'RE LOOKING AT FOLKS IN TERMS OF PARKING AND LAND USE. I WAS VISITING WITH THE CITY OF CANNONDALE AND THEIR COMMERCIAL. THEY'RE LOOKING AT ELIMINATING THE REQUIREMENTS AND LETTING THE DEVELOPER EXPRESS THAT. BUT IN IN SINGLE AND MULTIFAMILY, I THINK THEY'RE STILL GOING TO HOLD THAT BECAUSE WE'VE GOT A LOT OF PARKING, A LOT OF ACREAGE THAT IS NOT PRODUCING ANYTHING.

AND SO IF YOU CAN IDENTIFY SOME OF THOSE AREAS WHERE YOU THINK THAT WE'VE ALREADY REDUCED IT SOME AND WE'VE GOTTEN DEVELOPMENT IN THE FRONT OF PARKING LOTS AND SOME OF THESE MAJOR SHOPPING CENTERS. AND ONE THING ABOUT THESE PLANS IS THEY'RE ALMOST OUT OF DATE THE MOMENT THEY'RE FINISHED, BECAUSE THE MARKET IS SO CHANGING. IS THERE GOING TO BE A METHODOLOGY BUILT INTO WHERE WE CAN EASILY ADJUST OUR PLAN? THAT'S ONE OF THE THINGS THAT WE'VE GOT SEVERAL FOLKS ON OUR STAFF THAT USED TO WORK ON THE CITY SIDE AND, YOU KNOW, TRYING TO WITH THE LONG RANGE PLAN, YOU'VE GOT TO SET SOME OF THAT FRAMEWORK AND SOME OF THAT BIGGER PICTURE STUFF. BUT FOR IT TO BE LIVE AND BE USEFUL AND STAY. ACTIVE AND BE RELEVANT, IT'S GOT TO BE A FRAMEWORK THAT THERE'S A PROCESS TO UPDATE IT. THERE'S A PROCESS TO, YOU KNOW, UPDATE INFORMATION, UPDATE THE RECOMMENDATIONS AND ACTIONS. AND SO THIS IS NOT GOING TO BE SOMETHING WHERE WE GIVE YOU A TEN YEAR MENU OF HERE'S WHAT YOU HAVE TO DO IN YEAR ONE, YEAR TWO, YEAR THREE, YEAR FOUR. IT'S GOING TO BE HERE'S HERE'S BIG PRIORITIES. HERE'S SOME OF THE THINGS YOU HAVE TO DO TO GET STARTED. AND HERE'S A PROCESS TO REVISIT AND RESET. HOPEFULLY WE'RE GOING TO GIVE YOU THE FRAMEWORK THAT ALLOWS COUNCIL AND PLANNING COMMISSION AND STAFF TO UPDATE THAT. DON'T THINK THAT THIS IS DONE AND YOU PUT IT ON THE SHELF FOR TEN YEARS. IF YOU WANT TO KEEP IT OFF THE SHELF, YOU GOT TO KEEP IT OFF THE SHELF. AND I THINK WE'RE ALREADY ON OUR WAY THERE. IF YOU'VE LOOKED AT OUR PDS, WHICH ISN'T REFLECTED IN OUR REGULAR ZONING, WE ARE ALREADY GOING SMALLER. LOTS NEWER, INNOVATIVE HOUSING STYLES. SO HOPEFULLY THAT'S REFLECTED IN THE REPORT. AND IN TERMS OF TO MAYOR PRO TEM POINT IS GETTING PEOPLE TO ACCEPT THAT PROBABLY NEED SOME KIND OF ANALYSIS OF WHAT THE DIFFERENT GENERATIONS ARE WANTING. A FEW OF US UP HERE ARE IN THE OLDER GENERATION AND SO YOUNGER GENERATIONS, TO MY UNDERSTANDING, AREN'T NECESSARILY WANTING THE LARGER 7000 10,000 SQUARE FOOT. SO WE NEED TO BE ABLE TO ADJUST FOR THAT, THAT DEMOGRAPHIC STUFF THAT WE ALREADY HAVE. THERE'S A LOT OF STUDIES FROM NATIONAL ASSOCIATION OF REALTORS. OTHER. YEP. ALL RIGHT. WELL I THINK THAT'S ALL I HAVE. BUT AGAIN, BOY YOU'RE GETTING US THINKING AND KEEP IT GOING. THANK YOU.

YES. AND KEVIN, I DO WANT TO EXPRESS OUR APPRECIATION FOR THE WORK THAT YOU'RE DOING AND THE CHALLENGES THAT YOU'RE BRINGING FORWARD. I DO AGREE THAT, IN FACT, A LOT OF THE DISCUSSION THAT YOU'RE HAVING PRESENTLY, IT'S KIND OF AN IT'S AN OLDER GENERATION VERSUS THIS NEWER GENERATION AND TO DO DIFFERENT TWO DIFFERENT CONCEPTS. BUT I THINK THAT WHAT I WANT TO SAY IS I REALLY DO APPRECIATE AT THIS POINT, THE CITY OF GARLAND, ITS STAFF FOR BRINGING YOU IN, THAT WE CAN BEGIN TO BE PROACTIVE, BECAUSE I THINK THAT THAT IS WHAT'S GOING TO MAKE THE DIFFERENCE WHEN YOU BEGIN THE DISCUSSION. WHAT BEGINS TO HAPPEN AT THAT POINT IS WE BEGIN TO SEE WHAT OUR CHALLENGES ARE. BUT IN OBSERVING WHAT THE CHALLENGES ARE, WE ALSO ARE ABLE TO THEN SEE THESE ARE THE OPPORTUNITIES. AND THAT IS EXACTLY WHERE I FEEL THAT WE ARE THIS EVENING. AND WE WANT TO FIND OUT FROM YOU AT THIS POINT, WHERE DO WE GO FROM HERE? THAT'S A GREAT THAT'S A GREAT WAY TO WRAP IT UP THE NEXT STEPS FOR US, THERE'S OBVIOUSLY A DEEP DIVE INTO MORE OF THIS DATA WITH WITH STAFF TO DO. I DON'T RECALL WHEN OUR NEXT TRIP IS, BUT WE'RE STARTING TO MOVE FROM ALL OF THE INITIAL ASSESSMENT AND DATA AND DEMOGRAPHICS AND ALL THAT INTO, OKAY, WHERE WHERE DO WE START TO LOOK FOR PLACES THAT HAVE OPPORTUNITIES FOR INCREMENTAL WHERE PLACES, THE SHOPPING CENTERS THAT WE GOT TO START TO GROUP THOSE IN DIFFERENT AND

[01:40:02]

DIFFERENT BUCKETS. WE START TO LOOK AT THE MOBILITY SYSTEM A LITTLE BIT MORE. SO IT'S REALLY MOVING FROM JUST THE INITIAL ASSESSMENT INTO STARTING TO WHAT WE CALL THE EXPLORER. THE EXPLORE PHASE, WHERE WE'RE WE'RE LOOKING AT POTENTIAL STRATEGIES AND OPTIONS TO CLOSE THOSE GAPS.

THE GOOD NEWS IS ANYTHING YOU DO THAT WILL START TO CLOSE THAT THAT STREET PROPERTY TAX SERVICE REVENUE GAP IS ALSO GOING TO HELP ON THE UTILITY SIDE. SO IT'S JUST REALLY GENERALLY IF YOU'RE BIGGER MORE SPREAD OUT IT'S GOING TO COST MORE. PEOPLE HAVE TO PAY MORE EITHER IN THE VALUE OF THEIR HOMES OR RATES, PROPERTY TAX OR RATES. IF YOU'RE MORE COMPACT, EACH PERSON, EACH HOME CAN CAN PAY A LITTLE BIT LESS. AND IT'S FINDING WHERE GARLAND FITS AND WHERE EACH OF GARLAND'S NEIGHBORHOODS FIT ON THAT SPECTRUM. THANK YOU, THANK YOU. COMMISSION. COUNCIL.

APPRECIATE YOUR TIME. THANK YOU SO MUCH. IF ALL MINDS ARE SATISFIED, WE'LL ADJOURN AT 740

* This transcript was compiled from uncorrected Closed Captioning.