[00:00:01]
IT IS 3:46 PM ON AUGUST 15TH, 2025.
WELCOME TO THE DEVELOPMENT SERVICES COMMITTEE MEETING.
I'M MARGARET LUCK, AND I'M JOINED BY COMMITTEE MEETING COMMITTEE MEMBERS COUNCILMAN JEFF BASS FROM DISTRICT ONE AND COUNCILMAN JOE THOMAS, JR.
UH, JUST GOING BY THE AGENDA ITEM ONE APPROVAL OF MINUTES.
DO I HAVE AN APPROVAL OF THE MINUTES FROM OUR LAST MEETING ON MARCH 17TH, 2025? MOTION.
I HAVE A FIRST BY COUNCILMAN BASS.
DO I HAVE A SECOND? PRESS IT AS QUICK AS I COULD.
SO I'M NOT GONNA TURN ON THE MOTIONS AND EVERYTHING.
SHE'S NOT TRAINED FOR THAT SEAT, THOUGH.
IT'S THE SAME SEAT IS OUT THERE.
WE HAVE A SECOND BY COUNCILMAN THOMAS.
DO WE HAVE ANY PUBLIC COMMENTS TODAY? NOPE.
ITEM THREE ITEMS FOR INDIVIDUAL CONSIDERATION.
ORDINANCE STAFF WILL BRIEF THE COMMITTEE ON THE CURRENT STANDING OF THIS ITEM.
AND WHO DO, WHO DO WE HAVE PRESENTING? MS. NENER.
SO, JUST A LITTLE BIT OF SUMMARY AND BACKGROUND THAT WILL PROVIDE, UM, ABOUT HOW THE REQUEST CAME ABOUT.
I KNOW WE HAD, UM, LOOKED AT, WE HAD LOOKED AT, UM, WHAT KIND OF WAIVERS AND WHAT KIND OF VARIANCES WE HAD RECEIVED IN THE, UH, LAST 10 YEARS.
UH, WE HAD MADE A PRESENTATION, UM, SHOWING THOSE, UH, ON MARCH 27TH, 2025.
UM, AND BETWEEN 2015 THROUGH 2025, WE FOUND, UH, FIVE SIGN VARIANCES AND FIVE DOWNTOWN, UH, WAIVERS THAT WERE RELATED TO SIGNS.
UM, SO ALL OF THOSE WERE APPROVED.
SO THAT WAS KIND OF THE BACKGROUND, LIKE, HEY, DO WE HAVE A LOT OF SIGN VARIANCES OR WAIVERS OR NOT? AND, UH, WHY DO WE HAVE THOSE? IS THERE A WAY TO TACKLE IT IN THE SIGN ORDINANCE SO THAT THERE'S NO NOT AS MANY WAIVERS AND VARIANCES? AND I, I WILL ALSO PREFACE IT, WE DO NOT REALLY THINK THERE'S TOO MANY, THERE HAS BEEN 10 IN TOTAL.
BUT I THINK FROM THAT CONVERSATION, UH, THE DIRECTION WAS REGARDLESS, WE DO WANT US TO REVIEW OUR ORDINANCE AND, UH, MAKE SOME RECOMMENDATIONS OR COME UP WITH SOME IDEAS ABOUT HOW TO MAKE IT A LITTLE BIT EASIER FOR THE BUSINESSES TO COME TO THE CITY AND NOT HAVE TO GO THROUGH A SEPARATE PROCESS JUST TO GET THEIR SIGN UP THERE.
UM, SO JUST GENERALLY, WHY DO WE HAVE THE SIGN REGULATIONS TO PROTECT THE AESTHETIC CHARACTER, TO NOT OVERWHELM PEDESTRIANS OR, UM, VEHICULAR TRAFFIC, AND OBVIOUSLY TO ATTRACT, UM, COMMERCIAL AND CULTURAL COMMUNICATION.
UH, THERE IS A REASON WHY WE HAVE SOME STRICTER DOWNTOWN SIGN RESTRICTIONS, BECAUSE OBVIOUSLY THE, OUR DOWNTOWN IS SPECIAL.
THE USES ARE A LITTLE SPECIAL.
THE SCALE OF HOW THE LAND USE, INTERACT WITH HUMAN IN OUR DOWNTOWN, THAT IS A LITTLE DIFFERENT THAN THE REST OF THE CITY.
SO ALL OF THOSE REASONS ARE WHY WE HAVE, UM, SOME STRICTER SIGN REGULATIONS IN DOWNTOWN.
AND ABOUT HALF OF THE VARIANCES THAT CAME IN THE LAST 10 YEARS WERE IN DOWNTOWN.
UM, SO, UH, FROM THE LAST TIME, UH, WE WERE DIRECTED TO KIND OF FOCUS A LITTLE BIT ON, UH, MORE ON THE WALL SIGNS AND AWNING SIGNS.
AND THOSE ARE THE ONES THAT WE HAVE GOTTEN THE MOST, UH, VARIANCE REQUESTS.
UM, FOR, UH, WE ALSO HAVE, UM, A LOT OF DIFFERENT TYPE OF SIGNS LIKE MONUMENT SIGNS, UM, OTHER DIFFERENT TYPE OF SIGNS WHICH, UH, WERE NOT NECESSARILY BROUGHT UP AS A MATTER OF CONCERNS.
AND WE, WE DON'T REALLY SEE THAT
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MANY OF THOSE ASKING FOR A VARIANCE OR A WAIVER.SO, UM, CITYWIDE SIGN REGULATION GENERALLY FOR, UM, WALL SIGNS, THERE IS A RATIO SIGN AREA TO BUILDING WIDTH RATIO.
SO TWO SQUARE FOOT, UH, FOR A FEET OF WIDTH OF A BUILDING FOR A SINGLE TENANT.
AND THERE ARE MUL, THERE'S SOME CAVEATS TOO THAT I'M TRYING TO SIMPLIFY IT.
AND THERE'S OBVIOUSLY, OTHER THAN DOWNTOWN, THERE IS A MAXIMUM SIZE.
THERE IS A MAXIMUM PERCENTAGE.
SO REGARDLESS OF THE LINEAR, UM, WIDTH OF THE FACADE, IT CANNOT BE ASSIGNED OVER 200 SQUARE FOOT.
UM, ALSO IT CANNOT TAKE UP MORE THAN 75% OF THE, OF THE FACADE.
SO THINGS LIKE THAT ARE IN PLACE.
UM, OBVIOUSLY, AS I SAID, DOWNTOWN SIGN REGULATIONS ARE MORE RESTRICTIVE.
THE, THE AREA WHERE WE SEE THE MOST, UH, WAIVERS WHERE RELATED TO THE SIGN SIZE AS IT RELATES TO THE BUILDING HEIGHT.
SO IN DOWNTOWN, IF A BUILDING IS 10 FEET OR LESS, WHICH WE HAVE SEVERAL BUILDINGS HERE THAT ARE, UM, THAT HEIGHT, THAT ARE SHORTER BUILDINGS, UH, FOR THOSE THAT ALLOWED, UH, SQUARE FOOTAGE FOR THE SIGN IS ONLY 10 SQUARE FOOT, AND MANY DO CONSIDER IT TO BE VERY, UM, SMALL.
UM, AND IF IT'S 12 FEET, OR SORRY, IF IT'S 12 FEET OR LESS, IT'S 10.
IF IT'S 12 FEET OR MORE, IT'S 30 SQUARE FEET.
UM, SAME KIND OF RATIO TYPE, UM, REGULATIONS THAT WE HAVE FOR AWNING SIGNS.
SO WHAT ARE KIND OF OUR ALTERNATIVES? AGAIN, WE TALKED ABOUT IT.
AND THE VARIANCE PROCESS IS FOR SIGNS THAT ARE NOT IN DOWNTOWN.
SO, UM, THOSE Y'ALL DON'T GENERALLY SEE BECAUSE PLAN COMMISSION IS THE FINAL, UM, BODY TO APPROVE SIGN VARIANCE THIS WHOLE YEAR.
UM, ACTUALLY SINCE I'VE BEEN HERE IN THE LAST 10 MONTHS, I'VE ONLY SEEN ONE.
UH, AND, UM, AND IT NEEDS SUPER MAJORITY VOTE FROM PLAN COMMISSION TO APPROVE IT.
UH, BUT IT DOESN'T COME TO CITY COUNCIL.
UH, MINOR WAIVER CAN BE, UH, APPROVED ADMINISTRATIVELY.
THERE ARE SOME THINGS THAT COULD BE DONE, BUT, UM, THERE'S NOT THAT MANY SIGN RELATED ADMINISTRATIVE RELIEF.
WHEN, WHEN IT, UH, WHEN THE SIGN IS LOCATED IN DOWNTOWN MAJOR WAIVER, YOU ALL ARE VERY FAMILIAR.
YOU SEE IT ALL THE TIME IT COMES TO YOU.
IT, IT GOES THROUGH THE SIMILAR PROCESS OF A, SIMILAR TO A ZONING PROCESS, NOT AS ELABORATED, BUT IT GOES THROUGH PLAN COMMISSION, THEN IT COMES TO CITY COUNCIL AND CITY COUNCILS THE FINAL, UH, APPROVAL BODY ON THOSE SIGNS.
SO WE LOOKED AT SOME, UH, PEER CITIES AND WHAT WE FOUND OUR REGULATIONS ARE GENERALLY SIMILAR, UM, WHEN COMPARED TO RICHARDSON PLANO.
CARROLLTON, THEY ALSO USE SIMILAR RATIOS, TWO SQUARE FOOT PER ONE FOOT A FOOT WITH SIZE MAXIMUMS. UH, PLANO ALSO HAS A GUARANTEED MINIMUM ALLOWABLE SIZE FOR 40 SQUARE FOOT.
FRISCO USES DIFFERENT, THEIRS I WOULD SAY IS KIND OF A FORUM BASED FORMAT FOR SCIENCE.
AND I DO BELIEVE THAT IS A LITTLE BIT MORE COMPLICATED FOR A REGULAR BUSINESS PERSON TO UNDERSTAND.
OURS IS MORE STREAMLINED IN THAT ASPECT, I WOULD SAY.
WE ALSO DID SOME RESEARCH ON OUTSIDE OF TEXAS, BUT, UM, WE WOULD SAY OUR GENERALLY GARLAND SIGN REGULATIONS ARE DEFINITELY, UM, MORE PERMISSIVE WHEN COMPARED TO OUTSIDE OF, UH, TEXAS CITIES.
SO SOME, SOME ISSUES AND RECOMMENDATIONS.
AGAIN, THE BIG CONCERN WAS ARE THESE UNNECESSARILY RESTRICTIVE? WE DO THINK THERE IS AN OPPORTUNITY FOR WALL SIGNS, UM, TO HAVE BIGGER SIZE AND RATIOS WHEN IT'S LOCATED TO A MAJOR HIGHWAY.
SO WE HAVE 1 96, 35 I 30, SO ALL THOSE, WE DON'T NECESSARILY HAVE SPECIFIC STANDARDS WHERE SIGNS COULD BE LARGER WHEN THEY'RE LOCATED NEXT TO A HIGHWAY.
SO STRIKE IN RIO WHEN THEY WANTED TO HAVE THIS BIG, UM, SIGN.
THIS IS CONSIDERED A WALL SIGN, AND THIS IS A HUGE DEVIATION FROM WHAT'S ALLOWED.
UH, THEY HAD TO COME GET A SIGN VARIANCE.
UM, THE SECOND RECOMMENDATION THAT WE HAVE, UH, INCREASE THE DOWNTOWN SIZE LIMIT TO MATCH EXISTING SIGN SIZE.
UM, CURRENTLY THERE ARE SOME CREATIVE SIGNS IN DOWNTOWN.
SOME ARE, UM, MORE REGULAR SIGNS.
SO WE WERE THINKING OF KIND OF DOING AN AVERAGE OF THOSE AND TRY TO INCREASE THE ALLOWABLE SIZE TO MATCH THE AVERAGE.
AGAIN, THERE ARE PROS AND CONS THAT COULD BECOME MORE BUSINESS FRIENDLY.
SOME BUSINESSES MAY NOT HAVE TO COME BEFORE YOU, BUT AGAIN, YOU MAY LOSE THAT
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DISCRETION WHERE YOU HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY TO WEIGH IN WHEN SOMETHING IN DOWNTOWN'S, UM, DOWNTOWN IS COMING IN AND ASKING FOR, UH, A VARIANCE OR WAIVER.UM, ONE THING THAT WE KEEP HEARING IS LIKE ARTISTIC AND CREATIVE SCIENCE.
THAT IS SOMETHING THAT WE WANNA ACCOMMODATE AS MUCH AS POSSIBLE WITHOUT THEM HAVING TO APPLY, PAY A FEE, COME TO PLAN COMMISSION AND CITY COUNCIL.
SO WE HAVE OUR AMAZING CULTURAL ARTS DIVISION.
UM, SO WE CAN ESTABLISH SOMETHING THAT CAN, IT'S NOT JUST, OH, PLANNING LIKES THE SIGN, AND PLANNING THINKS IT'S CREATIVE, SO APPROVED.
NOT THAT IT GOES THROUGH A VETTING PROCESS THROUGH OUR CULTURAL ARTS COMMITTEE, BUT IT CAN SAVE TIME WHERE IT DOESN'T HAVE TO GO THROUGH, LIKE NOTICES HAVE DOESN'T NEED TO BE SENT OUT.
IT DOESN'T HAVE TO BE SCHEDULED.
SO IF CULTURAL ARTS, UH, APPROVE SOMETHING AS A, AS OF CULTURAL BEING CULTURALLY SIGNIFICANT OR ARTISTIC, THAT IS SOMETHING WE WILL GO AHEAD AND ADMINISTRATIVELY APPROVE SO WE CAN, UH, TAKE THAT APPROACH.
AND I THINK THAT WILL HELP CULTIVATE MORE CREATIVE AND ARTISTIC SIGNS IN DOWNTOWN.
ONE OTHER KIND OF PROCESS RELATED, UM, ISSUE WAS THAT HEY, WAIVER, THE WAIVER PROCESS COULD BE UNNECESSARILY BURDENSOME FOR, ESPECIALLY FOR SMALL BUSINESS OWNERS.
UM, AND WE, WE CAN SEE HOW THAT COULD BE.
SO ONE IDEA THAT WE HAVE IS, UM, THERE IS THE MINOR WAIVER PROCESS, WHICH IS ADMINISTRATIVE AND MAJOR WAIVER PROCESS, WHICH IS WHICH CITY COUNCIL NEEDS TO APPROVE.
SO HOW ABOUT IN, AND AGAIN, THE MAJOR AND MINOR WAIVER PROCESS IS NOT SPECIFIC TO SCIENCE WHEN IT COMES TO DOWNTOWN.
IT COULD BE CONSIDERED FOR MANY OTHER THINGS AND REGULATIONS, BUT WHEN IT COMES TO SIGNS, IF, UH, BECAUSE AS WE MENTIONED DOWNTOWN SIGNS OR SIGN REGULATIONS ARE STRICTER.
SO IF WE CAN SEE, UH, A DOWNTOWN SIGN IS NOT MEETING THE DOWNTOWN STANDARDS, BUT MEETING THE REGULAR SIGN CODE STANDARDS AND WE THINK IT'S APPROPRIATE, THEN HAVING A, AN AVENUE THERE TO APPROVE IT, APPROVE THAT ADMINISTRATIVELY.
AND THEN IF IT'S BEYOND, IF THEY WANT A SIGN THAT OUR REGULAR SIGN ORDINANCE DOESN'T EVEN, UH, ALLOW, THAT'S WHEN IT CAN COME TO PLANT COMMISSION AND CITY COUNCIL.
SO PROCESS WISE, THAT'S SOMETHING WE THINK COULD BE APPROPRIATE BECAUSE IT'S NOT GONNA BE THIS HUMONGOUS SIGN THAT ONE DAY WILL BE ERECTED AND PLAN COMMISSION CITY COUNCIL WILL BE, UM, SURPRISED.
IT WOULD BE THINGS THAT ARE ALREADY IN THE CODE, BUT THEY'RE ALLOWABLE IN THE GENERAL REGULAR SIGN STANDARDS.
ONE OTHER KIND OF, UM, CLEANUP THING THAT WE COULD FIND IS THAT THE WAY OUR SIGN ORDINANCE IS SET UP, IT'S COULD BE CONSIDERED CONFUSING SOMETIMES.
SO, UH, WE WERE THINKING OF JUST PUTTING IT IN, IN A TABLE FORMAT.
THAT'S, THAT'S HOW STAFF, UH, BUSINESS OWNERS AND ANYONE WHO'S USING THE ORDINANCE COULD, UM, USE IT IN A MORE, UH, USER FRIENDLY WAY.
SO THAT'S ANOTHER KIND OF CLEANUP TYPE RECOMMENDATION THAT WE HAVE.
BUT REALLY OVERALL, OUR SIGN ORDINANCE IS NOT OVERLY RESTRICTIVE BY ANY MEANS.
YES, THERE ARE SOME, SOME RESTRICTIONS THAT ARE CONSIDERED, UM, COULD BE CONSIDERED A LITTLE BURDENSOME, ESPECIALLY IN DOWNTOWN.
BUT DOWNTOWN IS ALSO A PLACE WHERE WE WANT TO HAVE MORE OVERSIGHT TO MAKE SURE THE PLACE AND THE EXPERIENCE THAT WE ARE TRYING TO CREATE IS NOT HINDERED BY MASSIVE SCIENCE.
SO GENERALLY THREE RECOMMENDATIONS, UM, IF I'LL LOOK FORWARD TO GETTING MORE DIRECTIONS ON, UH, WHICH RECOMMENDATIONS WE SHOULD MOVE FORWARD WITH.
COMMITTEE, ARE THERE ANY QUESTIONS? I THAT'S OKAY.
YOU CAN JUST, OH, THEY'RE ON, I'M NOT USING THE MONITOR.
HEY, NA, REALLY APPRECIATE THAT.
UM, APPRECIATE YOU GUYS, UM, PUTTING SOME THOUGHT INTO IT AND COME UP WITH SOME RECOMMENDATIONS.
SO CAN WE, LET'S GO BACKWARDS TO THE SLIDES REAL QUICK.
THIS ONE? NO, NO, GO, GO TO THE LAST ONE.
SO, UM, REALLY, REALLY LIKE THE IDEA OF CREATING AN AVENUE FOR IT TO GO THROUGH CULTURAL ARTS INSTEAD OF COMING THROUGH US.
SO HERE, HERE'S THE THINGS, AND, AND, AND I'M GLAD YOU REALIZED THAT, YOU KNOW, THIS AFFECTS SMALL BUSINESS AND SMALL BUSINESSES JUST OWNED BY REGULAR PEOPLE, RIGHT? MM-HMM
SO, UM, THE IMPORTANT THINGS ARE, YOU KNOW, CONSERVATION OF MONEY, TIME, AND, YOU KNOW, CONVENIENCE, EASE OF USE, RIGHT? MM-HMM
UM, AND YOU, YOU HIT ON ALL OF THAT, SO I'M GLAD Y'ALL LOOKED AT THAT.
AND SO, UM, YOU KNOW, THE LESS IT COSTS, THE QUICKER THEY GET THROUGH THE PROCESS AND THE EASIER IT IS TO UNDERSTAND THOSE ARE THE OBSTACLES WE NEED TO WORK WITH.
UM, SO I THINK GOING THROUGH CULTURAL ARTS NOW, IF WE DID SOMETHING LIKE IT GOING THROUGH
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CULTURAL ARTS, WHAT DO YOU GUYS FORESEE, LIKE, AS FAR AS TIME AND MONEY ASSOCIATED WITH THAT? WOULD THEY BE PAYING THE SAME PERMITTING? UM, WOULD THE, I DON'T KNOW HOW THE CULTURAL ARTS DIVISION MEETS AND WOULD, UM, HAVE Y'ALL THOUGHT ABOUT THAT PROCESS AT ALL? WE, WE HAVE NOT TALKED TO CULTURAL ARTS ABOUT, UH, ABOUT THAT, BUT THE DIRECTORS HERE, FEEL FREE TO CHIME IN IF YOU HAVE ANY THOUGHTS.UM, BUT I DO THINK WE WILL NOT, MY GEN MY FIRST THOUGHT IS WE, IF IT'S A CULTURALLY SIGNIFICANT SIGN, WE SHOULD NOT BE CHARGING THEM MORE FOR THEM TO BRING IT TO THE, SO SAME SIGN PERMIT FEE.
BUT, UM, WHATEVER, UM, MS. AMY WILL NEED ON HER END TO FACILITATE THAT, WE ARE MORE THAN HAPPY TO WORK WITH HER.
'CAUSE I WOULDN'T WANT, AND THEN I'M GLAD YOU HAD THAT.
'CAUSE ON THE PERMIT WE DON'T, I WOULDN'T WANNA SEE 'EM DETERRED FROM DOING SOMETHING SPECIAL BECAUSE IT COSTS, CORRECT.
SO WE WANNA ENCOURAGE, WE'RE ALREADY SPENDING MORE MAKING A CULTURALLY CORRECT ARTISTIC SIGN, AND THAT'S WHAT WE WANT, RIGHT? YEAH.
WE, WE WANNA ENCOURAGE THOSE KIND OF DYNAMIC MM-HMM
AND HOW COOL WOULD THAT BE TO FILL THE DOWNTOWN UP WITH REALLY COOL SIGNINGS LIKE THAT? I, I'M FOR IT.
SO WE HAVE A, A COMMISSION, UM, OF NINE MEMBERS APPOINTED BY Y'ALL THAT REPRESENT YOU.
UH, AND I FEEL LIKE, YOU KNOW, THIS WOULD BE A GREAT OPPORTUNITY TO ENGAGE THE COMMISSION, YOU KNOW, THAT WAY IT'S NOT JUST ONE STAFF PERSON OR A COUPLE OF STAFF PEOPLE, YOU KNOW, IT'S REALLY GETTING THE COMMISSIONERS TO, TO WORK THROUGH THE PROCESS.
I'M SURE WE CAN WORK WITH NABILA AND HER TEAM TO COME UP WITH A, YOU KNOW, A FLOW THAT FOLLOWS THAT WOULD BE IN LINE AND APPROPRIATE FOR WHAT A BUSINESS OR A PROPERTY OWNER MIGHT HAVE TO SUBMIT FOR A SIGN PERMIT.
UM, BUT THEN ALLOWS PERHAPS, YOU KNOW, ANOTHER, UM, ANOTHER PERSPECTIVE ON, ON THE SIGN, YOU KNOW, UH, AND USING THE COMMISSION IN THAT CAPACITY, YOU KNOW, AGAIN, I THINK WOULD SPEAK FOR THIS BODY AND ALSO PROVIDE SOMEWHAT OF A PROCESS.
AND OUR GOAL WOULD BE TO WORK WITH YOU.
UH, BUT LIKE THE TWO THINGS THAT YOU SAID DO NOT INCREASE THE PERMIT FEE BECAUSE WE DO WANT THEM TO, TO COME.
UH, BUT ALSO IT WILL PROBABLY TAKE A LITTLE LONGER THAN A REGULAR SIGN PERMIT BECAUSE WE'RE INVOLVING A SEPARATE, SEPARATE BODY.
BUT AS MUCH AS WE CAN MINIMIZE THAT, THAT WOULD BE A GOAL TO ESTABLISH THAT TIMELINE WHERE THE SIGN PERMIT, IF REGULAR SIGN PERMIT, THEY CAN GET IT IN 10 DAYS.
THIS COULD BE 20 MAYBE, BUT NOT TWO MONTHS, WHICH IS USUALLY IF THEY'RE COMING FOR A WAIVER.
'CAUSE WE HAVE TO NOTICE, WE HAVE TO SCHEDULE, THAT'S WHEN IT, IT'S MORE TIME.
SO THOSE WILL BE THE TWO BIG GOALS.
AND THE ONLY OTHER, THE OTHER QUESTION I HAD WAS, OKAY, SO YOU MENTIONED, UM, SOME SUGGESTIONS FOR DOWNTOWN, SUCH AS IF IT DOESN'T MEET THE DOWNTOWN REGULATIONS, BUT IT MEETS OUTSIDE OF DOWNTOWN.
YOU SAID WE COULD, WHO IS WE ON THAT? WHO COULD, WHO WOULD, THAT COULD FALL UNDER A MINOR WAIVER.
SO WE'LL HAVE TO MAKE AN AMENDMENT TO THE GDC TO MAKE THAT A MINOR AMENDMENT CRITERIA AND A MINOR WAIVER CAN BE ADMINISTRATIVELY APPROVED.
SO WE'LL JUST FOLLOW THE SAME PATH, THE PATH AS A MINOR WAIVER.
I JUST DON'T WANNA BURDEN YOU GUYS WITH MORE, YOU KNOW, ANOTHER COMPLETELY DIFFERENT AVENUE.
YOU HAVE TO NO, THAT, THAT'S WHY WE WANTED TO LIMIT YEAH.
BUT WE ALREADY HAVE ONE EXISTING.
UM, I, I THINK THAT'S ALL I HAD.
LIKE I SAID, I APPRECIATE YOU GUYS COMING UP WITH SOME IDEAS.
REALLY LOVE THE IDEA OF GETTING CULTURAL ARTS INVOLVED AND, AND AWESOME.
THANK YOU FOR LOOKING AT THIS.
SO, UM, THE DOWN THE ONE WITH THE CULTURAL ARTS, UH, WE'LL WORK WITH, UM, YOUR OFFICE TO COME UP WITH SOME GDC AMENDMENTS TO, BECAUSE ALSO WHAT WE DON'T WANT IS TO MAKE IT AN ARBITRARY THING, RIGHT? IT NEEDS TO BE SOMETHING THAT'S INCORPORATED IN THE GDC SO THAT IT CAN BE FOLLOWED CONSISTENTLY.
SO IT'LL BE SOME KIND OF AMENDMENT, UH, IN THE GDC AND WE CAN WORK ON IT.
AND THEN, UM, THE OTHER IS THE PROCESS IMPROVEMENT, WHERE WE WILL HAVE SOMETHING IN THE MINOR WAIVER CRITERIA THAT'LL ALLOW US TO APPROVE THOSE THAT MEET THE REGULAR, UM, SCIENCE STANDARDS ADMINISTRATIVELY.
ARE THOSE THE ONLY TWO THAT YOU, SIR, ARE LOOKING FOR? UM, WELL, YOU KNOW, I, I HAD SOME, AND I'M STILL WORKING WITH SOMEBODY ON AND AWNING TOO ABOUT SOME OF THE REGULATIONS FOR AWNING SPECIFICALLY DOWNTOWN.
UM, AND THE, THE, THE PARTICULAR ONE THAT WAS BROUGHT TO ME WAS FOR EPIPHANY.
AND I THINK THE BIGGEST CON PROBLEM THERE IS OF COURSE, THAT THE HEIGHT OF THE BUILDING OUT OF THE BUILDING.
SO, UM, I THINK THAT'S JUST A SPECIAL THING.
BUT IN THAT CASE, IF WE INCORPORATE THIS PROCESS BECAUSE THEY WERE, UH, NOT GO, THEY WERE GOING UP TO 30 SQUARE FOOT, IT WOULD FALL UNDER THE MINOR WAIVER AND IT COULD HAVE BEEN ADMINISTRATIVELY APPROVED, COULD HAVE BEEN DONE.
AND THAT COULD HAVE BEEN DONE FASTER.
LESS, LESS HEADACHE FOR SOMEONE WHO DOESN'T UNDERSTAND WHAT THEY'RE GOING THROUGH.
UM, NO, I, I THINK I'M GOOD FOR
[00:20:01]
NOW.I LIKE THE DIRECTION IT'S GOING AND YEAH.
MAYOR PRO TIM, COUNCILMAN THOMAS.
SO, UM, YOU KNOW, THE SMALL BUSINESSES INHERITING ALL UNIQUE BUILDING, SO I'M TRYING TO THINK OF WHAT I SAID ONE I CAN THINK OF VERSUS MAIN STREET CAFE.
AND SO THAT SIGN, I THINK IS KIND OF RIPE FOR SOME ARTISTIC TALENT TO BE RESERVATION.
YEAH, ACTUALLY, I MEAN, THAT, THAT IS, UM, SO THE LANDMARK COMMISSION, OR LANDMARK SOCIETY, UM, A FEW YEARS AGO ACTUALLY KIND OF CREATED AN INTERNAL LIST OF SIGNS THAT THEY FELT HAD SOME TYPE OF, UM, HISTORICAL MERIT OR, OR CHARACTER AND THAT, AND THAT'S INCLUDED ON A LIST.
BUT THAT'S ABSOLUTELY, AND GREAT EXAMPLE OF A VINTAGE SIGN THAT IF, IF THERE WERE TO BE SOME TYPE OF TRANSITION BETWEEN THE BUSINESS, YOU KNOW, YOU, YOU DON'T WANNA LOSE THAT SIGN.
AND, AND YOU ALSO DON'T WANNA SEE IT FALL INTO DISREPAIR EITHER.
WE'LL BE ADDRESSING THAT ALSO IN THE NEXT AGENDA ITEM.
AND ARE THERE OTHERS LIKE THAT AMY, YOU CAN THINK OF THAT ARE DOWNTOWN RELATED OR, UM, OR IS YOUR LANDMARK CITYWIDE? WELL, THE, THE LIST IS CITYWIDE.
THE, UH, LANDMARK SOCIETY AND INCLUDES A VARIETY OF SIGNS ACROSS THE CITY.
UH, IF I COULD GET A COPY OF THAT LIST, I'D LIKE TO SEE WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT.
JUST WHEN, WHEN IT'S CONVENIENT.
SO, I'D LIKE TO GO CITY MORE ON A CITYWIDE DISCUSSION, ESPECIALLY WHEN IT COMES TO ARTISTIC SIGNS.
UM, I, I DON'T WANT TO LIMIT THE CULTURAL ARTS, UH, COMMISSION TO JUST DOWNTOWN SIGNS.
I WOULD LIKE FOR THERE TO BE A PATHWAY FOR ANYONE WHO WANTS TO MAKE A, AN ARTISTIC SIGN, GO THROUGH THAT COMMISSION.
AND I'D REALLY LIKE TO GIVE THE COMMISSION THE AUTHORITY TO SAY, YES, THIS IS AN ARTISTIC SIGN, OR NO, YOU NEED TO GO BACK THROUGH THE OTHER PROCESS.
WE CAN MAKE IT A CITYWIDE AVENUE.
AND THEN, UM, BUT I, I DO WANT THEM TO BE ABLE TO SAY, OH, YOU'RE NOT QUITE THERE YET MM-HMM
SO, UM, MAYBE GIVE THEM AN OPPORTUNITY TO COME BACK IF YOU THINK IT'S APPROPRIATE, OR JUST SEND THEM BACK TO BACK TO STAFF.
WELL, AGAIN, I, I THINK, YOU KNOW, WORKING WITH YOUR OFFICE, THERE PROBABLY HAS TO BE SOME TYPE OF RUBRIC OR SOME TYPE OF EVALUATION FORM, BECAUSE AGAIN, YOU KNOW, THAT SUBJECTIVE ART, IT'S SO SUBJECTIVE.
SO, SO HAVING, AND AGAIN, THAT'S WHERE HAVING, YOU KNOW, THE COMMISSIONERS THAT YOU ALL APPOINT OFFERS A VARIETY OF PERSPECTIVE.
AND IT'S NOT JUST ONE PERSON MAKING, ONE PERSON MAKING THAT CALL.
IT PROVIDES A VARIETY OF VOICES.
I THINK THAT'S A FANTASTIC IDEA.
I'M REALLY EXCITED FOR YOU ALL TO BE ABLE TO KIND OF TAKE ON SOME OF THAT.
I THINK IT'LL PRODUCE SOME REALLY AMAZING THINGS.
UM, ON, WILL YOU GO BACK TO THE FIRST RECOMMENDATION SLIDE? THIS IS THE FIRST ONE.
SO, UM, HIGHWAYS, LET'S TALK ABOUT WHICH HIGHWAYS ARE INCLUDED BECAUSE 78 HAS SOME SIGNAGE GOING ON THAT I WOULDN'T NECESSARILY WANT TO.
UM, WE JUST HAD A CASE ABOUT IT AT OUR LAST COUNCIL MEETING.
UM, I DON'T WANT SOME OF THE BUSINESSES IN THERE TO FALL UNDER, JUST BEING ABLE TO SKIRT UNDER SOME REGULATIONS.
I THINK IF WE END UP GOING, LIKE IF WE GET THE DIRECTIVE TO GO WITH AN AMENDMENT FOR THAT, WE WILL BE DEFINING WHAT, LIKE, AND IT'S NOT THAT PARTICULAR HOW WE, WE, WE, THAT'S NOT WHAT WE HAD IN MIND.
WHAT WE HAD IN MIND IS REALLY MASSIVE, LIKE STRIKE AND RULE, LIKE IT'S NEXT TO 1, 1 90.
SO WE'LL BE VERY MUCH, WE'LL COME UP WITH THE TABLE.
AND, UM, CORRESPONDING REGULATIONS FOR THOSE.
UM, BUT I, THOSE ARE THE ONES THAT I'M THINKING OF.
NOT KIND OF INTERNAL, BIGGER THOROUGHFARE, NO.
BECAUSE 78 IS TECHNICALLY A HIGHWAY
SO, UH, AS FAR AS HAVING A, A GRANDFATHERED IN POLE SIGN AND SIGNAGE ON THE BUILDING, WHETHER IT BE AN AWNING OR JUST DIRECTLY ON THE BUILDING, I'D LIKE TO GO INTO SOME RESTRICTIONS ABOUT THAT.
I THINK IF THEY HAVE A POLE SIGN, THEN THAT'S THEIR, THAT'S THEIR SIGNAGE.
IF THEY HAVE NO POLE SIGN, THEN, THEN WE GO TO THE PROPORTION THAT'S ON THE BUILDING.
UM, AND IF THEY DON'T WANNA USE A POLE SIGN, THEY CAN TAKE IT DOWN AND THEY CAN USE THEIR BUILDING THAT YOU COULD RUN INTO A LOT OF ISSUES THERE.
[00:25:01]
UM, SO YOU'VE GOT A STRIP CENTER.THE STRIP CENTER HAS BIG MARQUEE SIGN.
RIGHT? WELL, THAT'S A POLE SIGN.
WELL, THEN THE INDIVIDUAL BUSINESSES NEED TO BE IDENTIFIED AS WELL.
YOU DON'T WANNA HAVE JUST A STRIP WITH NO BUSINESSES ON IT.
THAT ONE COULD GET KIND OF TRICKY.
UM, MAYBE JUST SAY FOR INDIVIDUAL BUSINESSES, BECAUSE WHAT I, WHAT I SEE IS THERE ARE GAS STATIONS, OR REALLY, IT, IT KIND OF RUNS THE GAMUT.
YOU HAVE A LARGE POLE SIGN MOST OF THE TIME IN DISREPAIR, AND THEN YOU HAVE A BUILDING SIGN AND THEN RIGHT UNDER THAT, AN AWNING THAT HAS SIGNAGE ON THAT AS WELL.
AND THEN THEY FILL UP THEIR WINDOWS WITH SIGNAGE ON TOP OF THAT.
SO, SO, JUST SO I UNDERSTAND, SO IN TERMS OF, UM, GRANDFATHERING, SO IF IT'S ALREADY A GRANDFATHERED WALL SIGN AND A GRANDFATHERED POLE SIGN AND A GRANDFATHERED PYLON SIGN, THEY ALL HAVE THEIR OWN RIGHTS.
BUT THIS IS A SITUATION WHERE YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT, WELL, THEY ALREADY HAVE A PYLON SIGN OR A POLE SIGN THAT'S GRANDFATHERED.
WELL, THEIR WALL SIGN IS NOT GRANDFATHERED.
WELL, IN THAT CASE, THEY'LL HAVE SOME KIND OF LIMITATION PER THE GDC IN TERMS OF WHETHER OR NOT THEY CAN HAVE A SIGN OR LIMITATION IN THE SIZE SIGN SIZE.
WELL, THERE'S ALREADY A LIMITATION IN THE SIZE.
SO YOU, YOU, YOUR INTENTION IS TO LIMIT THE EXISTENCE OF THE SIGN IF THEY ALREADY HAVE SOME OTHER KIND OF SIGN.
ESPECIALLY WHERE THERE'S LETTERING ON THE BUILDING ITSELF, OR LIKE A, A SIGN, WHATEVER, A, A LIKE A BOX SIGN OR WHATEVER WITH THE MM-HMM
WITH THE LETTERS THAT STICK OUT MM-HMM
AND AN AWNING AND LIKE, THINGS LIKE SNACKS, TOBACCO, BEER, CHECK CASHING.
HOW ABOUT SOMETHING THAT COULD WORK? 'CAUSE I'M JUST THINKING ON, ON SO MANY DIFFERENT APPLICATIONS THAT WOULD NOT, I THINK WOULD WORK, BUT SOMETHING RELATED TO THE TOTAL AMOUNT OF SIGNAGE ALLOWED COMPARED TO THE AREA.
WHETHER IT BE, I DON'T KNOW, TOTAL AREA OF THE BUILDING, AREA OF FACADE WHERE A SIGN COULD GO SOMETHING, BUT AS A PERCENTAGE.
UM, BECAUSE I MEAN, JUST LIKE IN THIS PICTURE STRIKING REEL, RIGHT? THEY'VE GOT A, THEY'VE GOT A, A WALL SIGN ON TOP AND THEY'VE GOT, TECHNICALLY GOT A WALL SIGN RIGHT THERE.
AND SO, UM, WELL, THEY ALWAYS HAVE THE ABILITY TO COME THROUGH AND ASK FOR THAT TO BE RIGHT.
BUT, AND WHAT YOU'RE, YOU'RE, YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT AESTHETIC RIGHTS.
I THINK A, I THINK A GOOD WAY TO HANDLE THAT WOULD BE AS A PERCENTAGE, YOU KNOW, LIMIT THE AMOUNT OF SIGNAGE IN A PERCENTAGE.
AND I THINK AS FAR AS WINDOWS GO, IT'S NOT ENFORCED, BUT WE ALREADY HAVE REGULATIONS.
IT'S JUST, IT'S JUST NOT ENFORCED.
UM, SO WE HAVEN'T REALLY INVESTIGATED THAT PIECE.
UH, BUT IF IT'S THE DESIRE OF THE COMMITTEE, WE CAN DEFINITELY SEE AND WORK WITH LEGAL TO SEE IF, WHAT KIND OF AVENUES THERE.
BECAUSE I THINK IF WE ARE SAYING, WELL, IF IT'S, IF THEY'RE ALLOWED TO HAVE A POLLAN SIGN AND POLE SIGN, BUT THAT'S WHY THEY CAN'T HAVE A WALL SIGN.
IT NEEDS TO BE KIND OF LOOKED THROUGH AND THOUGHT, WELL, THOUGHT OUT HOW WE ARE GONNA PUT IT IN THE GDC.
UM, BUT YEAH, I HAVE NOT LOOKED INTO THAT.
AND IF YOU WANT TO KIND OF SEPARATE THAT FROM THIS, WE, WE CAN TAKE THIS PART TO COUNCIL YEAH.
AND THEN KIND OF WORK ON THAT RESIDUALLY, IF, IF YOU'RE AMENABLE TO THAT.
IT'S ALWAYS EASIER IF IT'S ONE BIG ORDINANCE UPDATE, IT'S EASIER.
BUT IF I SEE THAT IT'S GONNA CAUSE ANY SIGNIFICANT DELAY, THEN I'LL LET THE COMMITTEE KNOW.
THEN WE CAN SEPARATE THAT, DECOUPLE THAT AND WORK ON IT SEPARATELY.
UM, DO YOU HAVE ANY MORE QUESTIONS BEFORE WE MOVE ON? IS THAT COWBOY HAT GONNA BE PART OF OUR HISTORIC SIGN? WELL, A AND I WERE JUST TALKING ABOUT THAT.
SO, YOU KNOW, UM, I TOOK A PICTURE OF THAT POLL AND PUT IT ON MY FACEBOOK PAGE.
I GOT THINK MORE REACTIONS THAN ANY MM-HMM
IT'S A BIG POLE AND IT'S 12 FEET DEEP.
SO
I MEAN, IF YOU THINK IN TERMS OF THE BIG BOOTS IN SAN ANTONIO, THERE'S A, A BOWLER IN, UM, DALLAS.
YOU KNOW, I MEAN, IT, IT, IT DOES KIND OF HAVE A, A SIGN FEEL BECAUSE IT IS ON A POLE AND WE ARE THE COWBOY HAT CAPITAL OF TEXAS.
BUT, UH, BUT IT IS, IT'S COMING TO GARLAND AS AN, AS AN ART PIECE.
AND THAT'S, YOU KNOW, TEXAS COMMISSION
[00:30:01]
ON THE ARTS DID HELP FUND A SCULPTURE.IT'S NOT ADVERTISING ANYTHING.
AND SO IT'S, AND THERE'S NOT GONNA, IS IT JUST GONNA BE THE HAT? THERE'S NO SIGN ON THERE.
THERE IS GARLAND, BECAUSE WE WANT THAT THING THAT IS A PHOTO OP THAT IS AN OPPORTUNITY FOR US TO SAY GARLAND, TEXAS.
AND, UH, SO THE, THE WORD GARLAND WILL BE ON THE HAT AND THERE WILL ALSO BE A VERY COOL, UH, BRAND.
MANY TIMES COWBOYS COW COWGIRLS WILL BRAND THEIR HAT.
SO IT IS GONNA ALL ABOUT GARLAND.
I DIDN'T KNOW, DIDN'T KNOW WHERE THAT FELL, IF THAT WAS PART, BUT THAT'S NOT PART OF THIS, SO, OKAY.
ITEM THREE B, HISTORICAL SIGNIFICANCE OF SPECIFIC SIGNAGE IN GARLAND.
SO WE HAD, UM, GIVEN THE COMMITTEE AN UPDATE ON HISTORIC SCIENCE.
LIKE HOW WHAT WE DO HAVE A SECTION ON HISTORIC SCIENCE HAS TO BE 50 PLUS YEARS.
AND, UM, THE HA THE SCIENCE THAT WE'RE INTERESTED IN, IN THIS CONTEXT, THE B HOUSE SIGN AND THE RIDGEWOOD, THOSE ARE, THOSE WILL ALL MEET THE 50 YEAR, UM, TIMELINE.
SO THEY'RE ELIGIBLE TO BE HISTORIC SIGN.
THE OTHER PIECE WAS, SO ON THAT, LET ME STAY ON THAT.
SO THERE, THE GDC IS NOT, DOES NOT SPECIFY WHO CAN APPLY FOR IT TO BE A HISTORIC SIGN, BUT IT IS WRITTEN WITH THE INTENT THAT A PROPERTY OWNER OR A TENANT, THEY'RE INTERESTED IN KEEPING THEIR SIGN AS HISTORIC AND THEY'RE APPLYING TO THE CITY SO THAT THE CITY CAN, THE CITY COUNCIL CAN DESIGNATE IT AS HISTORIC.
THAT'S, THAT'S HOW IT'S WRITTEN, BUT IT DOESN'T SAY THAT THE CITY CANNOT APPLY ON THE TENANT'S BEHALF.
SO THAT'S SOMETHING THAT WE NEED TO CHECK WITH LEGAL, THAT IF THE CITY WANTS TO APPLY ON THE BUSINESS OWNER'S BEHALF, IS THERE, IS THERE ANY COMPLICATIONS ON THAT? UM, IF THE BUSINESS OWNER DOESN'T AGREE THAT, HEY, I WANT TO HAVE THIS SINUS HISTORIC, BUT THE CITY WANTS TO, WHAT IS KIND OF THE LEGAL IMPLICATION OF THAT? SO THAT, THAT PIECE WE'RE INVESTIGATING.
THE OTHER PART WAS KIND OF TRYING TO SEE THE, IF WE COULD USE THE MATCHING GRANT, BUT AS Y'ALL ARE AWARE, UH, NONE OF THOSE BUSINESS OWNERS OR THE PROPERTY OWNERS WERE INTERESTED IN CONTRIBUTING IN ANY WAY, WHICH IS UNFORTUNATE, BUT THAT'S, THAT IS THE REALITY.
THAT IS WHY THE MATCHING GRANT PIECE WASN'T WORKING.
UM, AND THE, UM, OTHER PART WAS TO KIND OF SEE, UH, IF THERE IS, I KNOW THERE'S THIS COOL IDEA, AND BECKY, I DIDN'T EVEN KNOW THAT THIS IDEA EXISTED, UM, FOR SO LONG THAT FOR THE LAST SEVEN, EIGHT YEARS WE HAD THOUGHT OF, UH, AN INTERESTING PLACE OR DESIGNATING A PLACE WHERE ALL THOSE HISTORIC SIGNS COULD BE PUT AND THEN DISPLAYED AS A HISTORIC PRIDE FOR THE CITY.
SO THAT AVENUE, UH, WE THINK WILL TAKE MORE TIME, IT WILL TAKE MORE, UM, EFFORT FROM THE CITY TO FIND A PLACE, KIND OF FUNDING WISE FINANCIALLY, HOW WE'RE GONNA, HOW THAT MECHANISM WILL WORK.
BUT UNTIL THEN, FOR US TO BE ABLE TO PRESERVE THE SIGNS THAT WE'RE INTERESTED IN.
I KNOW, I REMEMBER, UM, SAM LUCK, YOU HAD BROUGHT UP THE GARLAND FLOWER SHOP SIGN.
THE FLOWER SHOP IS NOT THERE ANYMORE, BUT THE SIGN IS SO COOL.
SO WE ALREADY HAVE LIKE THREE, AT LEAST THREE SIGNS THAT WE HAVE IDENTIFIED TO BE HISTORICALLY OF SIGNIFICANCE TO US.
GDC GIVES THE AUTHORITY TO THE BUILDING OFFICIAL TO HANDLE THE HISTORIC SIGNAGE DESIGNATION PROCESS.
SO IT IS ON OUR LIST NOW TO MOVE FORWARD TO SEE WHAT WE NEED TO DO TO AT LEAST GET THOSE SIGNS TO BE DESIGNATED AS HISTORIC.
THAT WAY IF A DAMAGE WERE TO HAPPEN TO THOSE SIGNS, UM, THEY'RE NOT GONNA HAVE TO BE BROUGHT UNDER TODAY'S REGULATION, WHICH WOULD MEAN THEY'LL, THEY'LL LOSE THEIR SIGNIFICANCE.
SO THAT'S THE PATH THAT WE HAVE IDENTIFIED THAT IS KIND OF THE LOW HANGING FRUIT RIGHT NOW.
BUT THE, THE ONLY THING IS IF THE BUSINESS OWNER IS NOT INTERESTED, WHAT IS THE AVENUE IN THAT
[00:35:01]
PROCESS? SO THAT'S SOMETHING WE HAVE TO WORK WITH LEGAL AND WE'LL REPORT BACK ONCE WE HAVE MORE INFORMATION.DID YOU ALL HAVE ANY COMMENTS ON THAT? I COULD I ASK ONE? SO ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT SOMETHING LIKE THE NEON MUSEUM IN LAS VEGAS? YES.
BUT 'CAUSE THEY HAVE ALL OF THEIR STUFF THAT'S ALL IN ONE SPOT AT NIGHT.
IT'S ALL LIT UP LIKE IT ORIGINALLY WAS.
IS THAT, IT WOULD BE SO COOL TO HAVE IT, THE CONCEPT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT HERE.
AND WHERE ARE YOU PUTTING THAT THING? WE DON'T KNOW.
I'LL JUST GO ON THE RECORD FOR THAT.
ITEM THREE C, HISTORICAL SIGNS FACADE PROGRAM.
SO CURRENTLY OUR FACADE IMPROVEMENT, EXTERIOR IMPROVEMENT, UH, GRANT PROGRAM.
WE PROBABLY ONE OF THOSE PROBABLY HISTORIC SIGN.
THE OWNER OF THE BUSINESS, UM, APPROACHED US, UM, ASKING US IF THERE IS ANY HELP HE COULD GET.
SO AT THIS POINT, UH, AT THAT TIME, UH, LAST YEAR OR TWO YEARS AGO PROBABLY, THAT WE, WE TALKED TO HIM TWICE IN THE PAST.
UM, I LIKE TO SEE MORE THAN JUST A SIGN IMPROVEMENT.
SO THAT WAS THAT CONVERSATION AND NABILA MENTIONED, AND AT THAT TIME, THE PROPERTY OWNER WAS NOT WILLING TO PARTICIPATE.
AND THEN BUSINESS OWNER SAID, I DON'T REALLY HAVE MONEY TO DO ANYTHING.
MY RESPONSE IS, WELL, I LOVE TO SEE MORE THAN JUST SIGN.
SO YES, WE ARE HAPPY TO DISCUSS AND WE, WE LOVE TO SEE THE AVENUE TO REALLY HELP AND IT'S REALLY CREATING WIN-WIN SITUATION.
SO, BUT AGAIN, WE ARE, WE ARE HAPPY TO MODIFY THIS PROGRAM.
AND, UM, YOU KNOW, RIGHT NOW ON APPLICATION, WE DON'T REALLY HAVE A HISTORIC SIGN SPECIFICALLY MENTIONED.
BUT ONCE YOU KNOW THE, THE GDC, UM, AMENDED OR UPDATED, AND WE ARE HAPPY TO INCORPORATE IN THE FACADE OR EXTERIOR IMPROVEMENT PROGRAM OR GRANT PROGRAM.
WELL, WHAT IF WE, WHAT ABOUT WHEN WE GET OUR, UH, OTHER HISTORICAL SIGNS, THINGS GOING ON? MAYBE IT'S NOT A FACADE PROGRAM, BUT A PURCHASE PROGRAM.
SO WE'LL CROSS THAT BRIDGE WHEN IT COMES, I GUESS.
COMMITTEE, DO YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS FOR AACO? I DON'T ON THIS ONE.
ITEM 3D BOUNDED CH THREE 80 RESIDENTIAL IMPROVEMENTS.
SO, UH, I, I APOLOGIZE, I'VE LOST TRACK OF WHEN IT WAS, BUT, UM, AT SOME POINT IN THE PAST YEAR, THIS COMMITTEE ASKED, UM, US TO LOOK AT THE POSSIBILITY OF A BOUNDED THREE 80 AGREEMENT TARGETED AT UPGRADES TO RESIDENTIAL HOMES AND UPGRADES BEING MORE THAN JUST, YOU KNOW, EXTERIOR IMPROVEMENTS THAT WE HAD CURRENTLY OFFERED THROUGH THE HOME IMPROVEMENT INCENTIVE, UH, GRANT.
BUT, UM, SOMETHING MORE, UH, PROFOUND THAT INCREASES THE MARKET MARKETABILITY OF HOMES, UH, SPECIFICALLY YOU LOOK AT WHAT THE MARKET'S LOOKING FOR IN TERMS OF BEDROOMS, BATHROOMS, AND THEN JUST, UM, OTHER OUTDATED ELEMENTS LIKE STORAGE AND THINGS LIKE THAT.
UM, AND SO AT THAT TIME WE, WE DID A, WE DID SOME RESEARCH.
IT CAME BACK THAT NEEDED TO BE BOUNDED AREA AND CONNECTED TO AN ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT GOAL.
SO SINCE THAT TIME, WE HAVE, AND, AND I SHOULD ALSO SAY THAT WE WERE ASKED, UM, BY COUNCILMAN OTT TO SPECIFICALLY LOOK AT THE AREA BETWEEN, UH, GLENBROOK GARLAND AND AVENUE WALNUT AND BUCKINGHAM AS A STUDY AREA FOR THAT BOUNDED THREE 80 AGREEMENT.
SO IT JUST SO HAPPENED THAT ABOUT THAT SAME TIME, WE WERE GETTING READY TO LAUNCH OUR ANNUAL, WHERE THE HEART IS PROGRAM IN THE FREEMAN HIDES NEIGHBORHOOD, WHICH DOES FALL WITHIN THOSE BOUNDARIES.
AND SO WHAT WE, WE'VE KIND OF TAKEN A TWO-PRONG APPROACH TO THIS.
THE FIRST BEING, SINCE WE WERE LAUNCHING WHERE THE HEART IS IN THAT AREA, UM, WE HAVE
[00:40:01]
PARTNERED WITH THE GARLAND HOUSING FINANCE CORPORATION TO, UM, GET A, THEY HAVE SET ASIDE SOME FUNDING.SO COUNCIL, UM, LOOKED AT A GRANT THAT CAME FORWARD FOR THE FREEMAN HEIGHTS AREA, UM, AT THE, I GUESS THE PAT TWO WORK SESSIONS AGO.
IT'S ACTUALLY ON TUESDAY NIGHTS, UH, CONSENT AGENDA THAT IS A DIFFERENT GRANT.
SO THE ONE I'M TALKING ABOUT IS, UM, MONEY THEY'VE SET ASIDE TO DO A DEMONSTRATION HOME THAT WOULD BE, UH, A HOME UPGRADE.
AND SO THE PURPOSE OF THAT BEING IS TO, YOU KNOW, DOCUMENT THE, THE FINANCIAL POSITION OF WHAT IT WOULD TAKE TO REALLY TRANSFORM A HOME IN THAT NEIGHBORHOOD INTO WHAT WE THINK THAT, UM, THE MARKET DESIRES.
AND, UH, WE ARE CURRENTLY ACTIVELY LOOKING FOR A HOUSE TO BE THAT CANDIDATE.
SO THAT'S CALLED THE, UM, GROWING FAMILIES DEMONSTRATION HOUSE PROGRAM.
AND, UH, SO FAR WE HAVE NOT FOUND A GOOD CANDIDATE TO PURCHASE.
UM, IT, IT'S KIND OF A GOOD STORY THOUGH BECAUSE, UH, THE REASON FOR THAT IS A LOT OF THOSE HOMES ARE BEING, UH, RENOVATED TO SOME DEGREE NOW.
THEY'RE, UM, IT'S NOT THE UPGRADE NECESSARILY, BUT BECAUSE THEY HAVE BEEN RECENTLY REMODELED, IT PRICES THEM OUT OF WHAT WE COULD THEN TURN AROUND AND, AND PURCHASE AND MAKE SENSE TO DO A PROJECT ON.
WE NEED TO PURCHASE ONE THAT HAS NOT ALREADY RECENTLY BEEN REMODELED.
UM, SO WE'RE STILL WORKING ON THAT.
WE'RE STILL LOOKING FOR A GOOD CANDIDATE IN THAT NEIGHBORHOOD TO DO A DEMONSTRATION PROJECT ON.
IN ADDITION TO THAT, WE HAVE A CONSULTANT, CZB CONSULTING, AND THEY ARE WORKING ON A COMPREHENSIVE HOUSING STUDY OF THE ENTIRE, UH, GARLAND HOUSING MARKET.
AND PART OF THAT EFFORT WILL INCLUDE, UM, CATEGORIZING ALL OF GARLAND'S NEIGHBORHOODS INTO A TYPOLOGY.
ALL NEIGHBORHOODS IN GARLAND WILL BE PUT IN ONE OF THOSE, THOSE TYPOLOGIES.
AND, UM, THOSE TYPOLOGIES INCLUDE A LOT OF DIFFERENT THINGS, BUT THEY'RE LOOKING AT MARKET COMPETITIVENESS OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD.
AND ONE OF THE DELIVERABLES THAT THE CONSULTANT HAS BEEN TASKED WITH IS TO LOOK AT THE FULL SPECTRUM OF, UH, HOME INCENTIVE PROGRAMS. EVERYTHING FROM THE, THE AS SWAGGO MODEL OF SMALL, UH, YOU KNOW, YARD IMPROVEMENTS ALL THE WAY TO A, A FULL HOME RECONSTRUCTION.
AND, UH, TO COME BACK AND MAKE RECOMMENDATIONS ON WHAT STRUCTURE OF INCENTIVE PROGRAM IS THE BEST FIT FOR GARLAND'S HOUSING MARKET.
AND THEN GO A STEP FURTHER SPECIFIC TYPES OF NEIGHBORHOODS WITHIN GARLAND'S MARKET BECAUSE, UM, YOU KNOW, DEMAND, WE, WE ALL HAVE A FEELING FOR THE HOUSING STOCK AND THE SUPPLY SIDE.
UM, BUT YOU ALSO HAVE TO, TO HAVE AN EFFECTIVE INCENTIVE PROGRAM, YOU ALSO HAVE TO LOOK AT THE DEMAND SIDE AS WELL AS THE HOUSEHOLD CAPACITY.
SO, UM, WHETHER A HOUSE HAS LEVERAGE TO BORROW MONEY OR NOT.
UM, AND THEN IF YOU'RE TRYING TO WORK WITH A DEVELOPER, YOU'VE GOT TO TAKE THE DEMAND, UM, EQUATION INTO WHAT THEIR RESALE VALUE, UH, POTENTIAL IS IN A NEIGHBORHOOD.
SO THAT CONSULTANT'S BEEN TASKED WITH THAT, AND WE ANTICIPATE THAT DELIVERABLE IN SEPTEMBER COMMITTEE.
DO YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS? I HAVE, UH, I HAVE ONE, IF I COULD SURE.
JUST HELP ME WITH MY GLOSSARY OF TERMS. WHAT DOES BOUNDED THREE CH THREE 80 MEAN? SHOULD I TRY TO ANSWER THAT OR IS THIS THE ATTORNEY'S OFFICE ONE
YOU WANNA, THE CHAPTER THREE 80 IS WHAT WE USE THE CHAPTER THREE 80.
UH, ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENTS AGREEMENTS ARE TYPICALLY WHAT WE USE TO SPUR ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT WITHIN THE CITY.
UM, THERE ARE SPECIFIC RULES AND REGULATIONS THAT ARE ON THOSE BY STATE STATUTE.
THAT MEANS THAT WE HAVE TO HAVE SPECIFIC CONTROLS AND STUFF IN CHARGE TO MAKE SURE THAT IT IS PROVIDING AT THE END OF THE DAY, WHILE WE ARE USING PUBLIC FUNDS, THAT IN WE'LL TANGENTIALLY IMPROVE OR, OR DO SOMETHING FOR A PRIVATE PARTY.
THE ULTIMATE GOAL BEHIND IT IS THAT WE'RE DOING SOMETHING THAT'S FOR A PUBLIC BENEFIT.
[00:45:01]
SPECIFICALLY TRYING TO DO IT HERE, THAT'S NOT GONNA BE COMMERCIAL.PART OF THE WAY THAT WE CAN ENSURE THAT IT'S PROVIDING A PUBLIC BENEFIT AT THE END OF THE DAY IS THAT IT'S GOING TO BE BOUNDED, WHICH MEANS IT'S WITHIN A CERTAIN AREA.
I I, AND THAT'S ALSO A KEY PART OF THE COMPREHENSIVE HOUSING STUDY, IS THAT CONSULTANT WILL BE CREATING BOUNDED AREAS WITH SPECIFIC, UH, GOALS OR STRATEGIES FOR THOSE AREAS.
SO IT HELPS SATISFY THE LEGAL REQUIREMENT.
WE ALSO HAVE DEPUTY MAYOR PRO TIM OTT WITH US, AND HE BROUGHT THIS ITEM ORIGINALLY.
DO YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS FOR STAFF? UH, IT WAS MOSTLY HERE TO HEAR THE PRESENTATION AND, UM, I'M IMPRESSED WITH, UH, WITH WHAT YOU'VE ACCOMPLISHED IN SIX MONTHS.
I MEAN, WE'VE GOT A, WE HAVE A, WE HAVE A PILOT PROGRAM THAT'S GONNA BE FOR THE FREEMAN HEIGHTS AREA.
WE HAVE A NEW, UH, THAT'S A, THAT'S A PERFECT AREA FOR, UH, FOR, UH, THIS TYPE OF A PROGRAM BECAUSE THEY HAVE A BRAND NEW SCHOOL THAT'S BEING BUILT IN THAT AREA.
IT'S GONNA BE REPLACING ALL OF THE SIDEWALKS.
AND SO PUTTING THIS TOGETHER WITH THAT, IT'S GOING BE, UH, REALLY A GOOD TEST CASE AND TO FIND OTHER PLACES WITHIN THE CITY TO BE ABLE TO DO THINGS, BE, UH, THAT'S, IT'S GONNA BE VERY INTERESTING TO SEE WHAT THEY FIND.
AND THE CITY OF RICHARDSON HAS BEEN DOING A LOT OF THREE 80 AGREEMENTS FOR DOING DEVELOPMENTS, UH, FOR QUITE A WHILE.
AND THAT'S KIND OF WHERE THE, THE GENESIS OF WHERE I KIND OF GOT THE IDEA OF WHERE THIS, WE MIGHT BE ABLE TO LEARN FROM OUR NEIGHBOR.
AND IT'S HELPED THEM QUITE A BIT.
AND YOU FIX ONE, ONE HOUSE IN ONE STREET, AND SUDDENLY IT STARTS FIXING ALL OF THE HOUSES ALONG THE WAY.
SO IT'S THE RISING HEIGHT, UH, RI RISING, UH, TIDE FLOATING ALL BOATS TYPE OF THING.
BUT I THANK YOU FOR EVERYTHING THAT YOU'VE BEEN DOING.
WE ACTUALLY HAD THIS ITEM COME THROUGH DEVELOPMENT SERVICES A LONG TIME AGO, AND WE WERE DENIED BY THE CITY ATTORNEY'S OFFICE.
BUT I'M CURIOUS, ONCE THAT STUDY COMES THROUGH, UM, IF YOU CAN'T FIND A HOME IN THE, WHERE THE HEART IS, NEIGHBORHOOD FREEMAN HEIGHTS, WOULD THAT STUDY GIVE YOU ADDITIONAL AREAS TO CONSIDER FOR THIS PROJECT? YES, IT WOULD.
MAYBE WE COULD EVEN DO A COUPLE.
UM, I, I WOULD LOVE TO SEE THAT.
SO, UM, I THINK ANY PROGRAM THAT, UH, ENCOURAGES HOMEOWNERS IN GARLAND TO INCREASE THE SQUARE FOOTAGE OF THEIR HOME, WHICH IS ULTIMATELY WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT, UM, IS A STEP IN THE RIGHT DIRECTION.
UM, 'CAUSE THAT'S, THAT'S REALLY OUR CHALLENGE, ISN'T IT? SO
UM, ITEM THREE E REVIEW, SUP PROCESS SCOPING DISCUSSION.
SO FOR SCOPING DISCUSSIONS, WE GENERALLY, UM, DON'T HAVE, UM, PRESENTATIONS FOR THIS ONE.
WE WANTED TO PRESENT YOU WITH SOME GENERAL INFORMATION BEFORE WE CAN GATHER WHAT THE COMMITTEE IS, UM, REALLY LOOKING FOR, AND THEN GO FROM THERE.
UM, SO, UM, WHAT WE ARE TRYING TO DO IS, OBVIOUSLY EVERYONE'S AWARE IN THIS ROOM, UH, SUVS ARE SPECIFIC USE PROVISIONS THAT ARE, UH, PART OF A ZONING TOOL.
UH, PEOPLE, LIKE IN OUR LAND USE CHART, YOU'LL SEE PS, WHICH IS PERMITTED, AND S WHICH ARE SUVS, WHICH MEANS IN A PARTICULAR ZONING DISTRICT, A USE IS NOT CONSIDERED FULLY PERMITTED, BUT DEPENDING ON THE LOCATION AND OTHER FACTORS, CITY COUNCIL AND PLAN, PLAN COMMISSION AND CITY COUNCIL HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY TO SAY, HEY, IN THIS LOCATION, THIS USE WOULD BE APPROPRIATE.
IT ALSO KEEPS ALL THE BASE ZONING IN PLACE.
IT'S JUST ANOTHER USE THAT IS APPROVED ON TOP OF THAT.
UM, SO RIGHT NOW, UH, OUR CITY COUNCIL, UM, DOES HAVE TIME PERIODS ASSOCIATED, UH, WITH SUVS.
AND IN RECENT TIMES THAT, UM, THAT WHOLE CONVERSATION ABOUT THE TIME PERIOD THAT WE HAVE, HOW DO WE DO IT? HOW DO WE TRACK IT, AND HOW DO EVEN THE APPLICANTS KEEP TRACK OF THAT TO BE ABLE TO RENEW THEM ON TIME, UM, HAVE COME UP.
SO THAT'S WHERE THIS ITEM ORIGINATED FROM.
UM, OH, LET ME JUST GO TO THIS SLIDE SHOW.
[00:50:01]
COUNCIL ADOPTED THE SUP TIME PERIOD POLICY GUIDE, AND YOU'LL SEE IN OUR PRESENTATIONS WHEN WE HAVE AN SUP APPLICATION, WE WILL REFER TO THIS GUIDE AND SAY, HEY, THIS IS WHAT THE SUP GUIDELINE SAYS.AND, UM, OFTEN OUR RECOMMENDATIONS ARE TAILORED FROM THERE.
UM, BUT IT, WE DIDN'T REALLY FIND A HUGE RATIONALE REGARDING HOW THIS TIMELINE WAS CREATED.
UM, SO THAT'S WHERE IT'S A LITTLE CONFUSING.
HOW DID WE DECIDE THAT FOR A CELL STORAGE 30 TO 40 YEARS WOULD BE AN APPROPRIATE TIMEFRAME? WE DON'T REALLY HAVE A WAY TO SAY THAT.
SO I DO THINK IT IS ALSO, WHILE WE ARE REVIEWING THE SUVS, IT IS ALSO A GOOD TIME TO REVIEW THE TIME PERIOD GUIDE AND SEE WHAT THE RATIONALES, UM, ARE ON THOSE SPECIFIC USES.
SO SOME, UH, GENERAL ANALYSIS, WE CURRENTLY HAVE, UM, 313 ACTIVE SUVS AS OF JUNE 18TH, 2025.
UM, MAJORITY OF THEM ARE LIKE, NOT MAJORITY, 22% ARE RESTAURANT WITH DRIVE-THROUGHS.
FOUR, THERE ARE 18% THAT ARE PUBLIC UTILITY AND 12% THAT ARE GAS STATIONS.
WE ALSO TRY TO KIND OF GEOCODE AND LOCATE WHERE THOSE SUVS ARE AND WHAT YOU SEE IN LIGHT GREEN.
THOSE ARE THE RESTAURANT WITH DRIVE-THROUGHS.
BUT THERE ARE ALSO ALL SORTS OF OTHER KINDS OF SUVS ALL ACROSS THE CITY, UM, THAT HAVE BEEN GRANTED ARE CURRENTLY ACTIVE.
MOST OF THEM DO HAVE A TIME PERIOD.
THERE ARE SOME THAT ARE INDEFINITE.
SO THOSE ARE THE ONES, THERE ARE NO TIMEFRAMES, BUT MOST OF THEM DO HAVE A TIMEFRAME ASSOCIATED WITH IT.
SO GENERALLY SPEAKING, UM, 53% OF THE ACTIVE SUVS ARE ISSUED FOR 20 TO 25 YEARS, UM, DRIVE THROUGH RESTAURANTS.
GAS STATIONS TEND TO HAVE 20 TO 25 YEAR AS WELL.
UH, AND THERE ARE OTHER PUBLIC UTILITY TYPE USES THAT ARE GRANTED EVEN LONGER TIME PERIOD, WHICH DOES MAKE SENSE.
SO THERE ARE SOME THAT WE PICK, UM, AND WE ARE SHOWING THROUGH THIS GRAPH, UM, WHAT ARE THE DIFFERENT TIME, LIKE HOW MANY, WHAT ARE, HOW MANY OF THOSE USES HAVE, HOW, HOW MUCH TIME PERIOD SOLELY FOR US TO GET A PROPER UNDERSTANDING OF WHERE WE STAND TODAY.
SO WHEN WE LOOKED AT OTHER CITIES, UM, ONLY TWO CITIES IN THE METROPLEX HAVE THE TIME PERIOD ASSOCIATED WITH SUVS.
AND DALLAS DOES HAVE MUCH, MUCH SHORTER TIMEFRAMES.
UM, THEY DO HAVE TWO YEARS, THREE YEARS, FIVE YEARS FOR GAS STATIONS.
THOSE ARE THE, THEIR REGULARS.
THEY DO IT FOR TWO YEARS OR THREE YEARS, OR FIVE YEARS.
UM, THE LONGER ONES LIKE WE HAVE ARE NOT AS COMMON IN DALLAS, BUT THEY DO IMPLEMENT A TIMEFRAME WITH EVERY SINGLE SUP TAN OF FLOWER MOUND.
THEY DID APPROVE THIS PRACTICE A FEW YEARS AGO, BUT IN REALITY, THEY HAVE NOT NECESSARILY BEEN ASSIGNING THE TIMEFRAMES CONSISTENTLY FOR EVERY SINGLE SUP.
SO WHAT ARE KIND OF THE CHALLENGES AND THE RISKS? OBVIOUSLY SINCE THE TIME PERIOD, WE COULDN'T REALLY FIND A TRUE RATIONALE BEHIND WHERE IT CAME FROM.
WHAT'S THE RATIONALE BEHIND SAYING THIS, USE DESERVES TO HAVE 20 YEAR TIME PERIOD VERSUS THIS USE ONLY DESERVES TO HAVE FIVE YEAR.
SO SINCE THERE'S NO PARTICULAR RATIONALE, THERE'S THAT RISK THAT WE'RE NOT ALWAYS, UM, FULLY CONSISTENT WITH, UM, HOW IT'S BEING, HOW WE ARE RECOMMENDING IT.
AND ALSO FOR CERTAIN USES FOR A STRIP CENTER OR A SHOPPING CENTER, IF IT'S A TENANT SPACE, IT MAKES SENSE FOR SOMEONE TO, UH, COME IN.
AND THEN AS UP IS GRANTED FOR 10 YEARS, BUT IF IT, IF THEY DON'T GET THE RENEWAL, THEY LEAVE AND THEN SOME OTHER USE COME COMES IN.
BUT FOR OTHER USES THAT REQUIRE SIGNIFICANT INFRASTRUCTURE AND OTHER TYPE OF INVESTMENTS, FOR EXAMPLE, A GAS STATION, SO LET'S SAY IT'S BEEN APPROVED FOR 10 YEARS.
10 YEARS IS UP, IT'S HIGHLY, UNLESS IT'S FULLY READY, RIPE FOR REVITALIZATION, YEAH, THE GAS STATION CAN CEASE TO OPERATE IF WE DON'T RENEW THE SUP.
BUT THE, THE, THE PUMPS ARE THERE.
SO THAT IS SOMETHING THAT COULD BE AN UNCERTAIN ELEMENT FOR THE, UM, PRIVATE SECTOR.
UM, BUT SHORTER TIMEFRAMES, UM, WOULD BE AN ISSUE FINANCIALLY FOR BUSINESSES BECAUSE THEY WANNA BE SURE THEY CAN OPERATE FOR A CERTAIN PERIOD OF TIME FOR THAT TO MAKE SENSE.
UM, BUT THEN AGAIN, IF IT'S TOO LONG, 30 YEARS, THEN WE RUN INTO A MATTER OF, OKAY, HOW ARE WE TRACKING THIS IN
[00:55:01]
30 YEARS, WHERE THE POLICY WOULD STAND? THINGS LIKE THAT.SO THERE ARE PROS AND CONS, UH, BOTH WAYS.
SO AGAIN, THIS IS THE SCOPING DISCUSSION.
OBVIOUSLY, UH, WE ARE HERE TO LISTEN FROM YOU WHAT SPECIFICALLY THE GUIDANCE WOULD BE FOR US TO GO LOOK FOR IT, BUT WE WANTED TO PROVIDE SOME, SOME BASELINE INFORMATION.
UH, BUT I DO WANNA SAY, UH, WITH THE IMPLEMENTATION OF SALESFORCE, WE HAVE ACTIVELY WORKED WITH THEM TO INCORPORATE THAT.
I HAVEN'T SEEN HOW IT'S GONNA WORK, UM, FIRSTHAND YET.
BUT THE, THE, THE DEVELOPERS DO KNOW THAT THEY HAVE TO PROGRAM IT FOR EVERY SINGLE SUP TO, FOR US TO ENTER A TIME TIMEFRAME.
AND THEN SIX MONTHS BEFORE THE EXPIRATION DATE, THE SYSTEM WILL GENERATE A WARNING TO STAFF AND POSSIBLY TO THE APPLICANT.
AND THAT'S, THAT'LL BE A HUGE LEAP IN BEING ABLE TO TRACK THEM.
AS OF NOW, WE HAVE JUST FINISHED LISTING ALL THE ACTIVE SUVS, AND RIGHT NOW THERE'S NO TRUE ENFORCEMENT OF THE EXPIRATION.
AND YOU SEE THAT VERY REGULARLY, WHERE THERE ARE CASES WHERE THEIR SUVS EXPIRED SEVERAL YEARS AGO AND THEY DIDN'T, THEY DIDN'T EVEN KNOW THAT, OR THEY DIDN'T EVEN REMEMBER.
SO I THINK WITH THE IMPLEMENTATION OF SALESFORCE, IT'LL GET MUCH EASIER.
BUT OVERALL POLICY WISE OR AMENDMENT WISE, UM, I'M HERE TO LISTEN WHAT Y'ALL, UM, THINK, UM, THAT'S WHY THIS WAS INITIALLY BROUGHT FORWARD WAS BECAUSE PEOPLE WERE, PEOPLE'S S WERE EXPIRING AND THEY WEREN'T, NO ONE WAS AWARE KIND OF, THAT'S, THAT'S WHAT THE WHOLE PURPOSE OF THIS ITEM WAS.
UM, I WOULD LIKE TO GO OVER THE TIME PERIODS.
I THINK THAT WOULD BE A GOOD EXERCISE IN FUTILITY FOR US.
UM, SO YEAH, I, I WOULD LIKE TO GO OVER THE TIME PERIODS.
I THINK THAT'S REALLY ALL THAT WE CAN DO HERE.
UM, OR THAT I, I DON'T, I DON'T KNOW THAT I WANNA GET INTO, UM, MUCH MORE THAN LOOKING AT THOSE TIME PERIOD GUIDELINES COMMITTEE.
DO YOU HAVE ANY THOUGHTS? NO, NO, NOTHING ELSE THAN THAT.
SO I'D LIKE TO KEEP THE, THE SCOPE JUST TO THAT OKAY.
AND THEN, UM, BECAUSE I THINK SALESFORCE WILL TAKE CARE OF A LOT OF THE OTHER ISSUES THAT MM-HMM
THE REASON THAT IT WAS BROUGHT FORWARD.
AND I'M EXCITED FOR THAT TO START WORKING.
AND I, I WILL SAY THOUGH, BECAUSE THIS WAS BROUGHT FORWARD, BECAUSE WE STARTED NOTICING THESE, UM, THAT'S WHAT PROMPTED US TO GO AND LIST IN GEOCODE ALL THE EXISTING SUVS.
NOW, EVEN THOUGH IT'LL TAKE, TAKE FOR SALESFORCE TO BE ACTIVATED A LITTLE LONGER, BUT WE HAVE A WAY TO AT LEAST LOOK AND TRACK SOMEWHAT MANUALLY UNTIL THEN.
SO IT'S A GOOD THING THAT THIS WAS BROUGHT UP.
AND SINCE WE HAVE NEW ZONING AREAS NOW, UM, LIKE URBAN MM-HMM
URBAN BUSINESS, UM, HAVING AN SUP TRACKING SYSTEM FOR THAT AREA IS EXTREMELY IMPORTANT, ESPECIALLY WHEN YOU'RE CONSIDERING NON-CONFORMING USES.
UM, THIS IS, IT'S, IT'S A, I I'M, I'VE BEEN EXCITED FOR IT FOR THREE AND A HALF YEARS, SO I'M
WE'LL TAKE, UH, TAKE A LOOK AT THE TIMEFRAME THEN AND WE'LL REPORT BACK.
ARE YOU STAYING FOR THE NEXT ONE, THREE F REVIEW SIGN ORDINANCE SCOPING DISCUSSION? WELL, IS THAT DIFFERENT THAN WHAT WE ALREADY DID? I, I'M JUST READING DOWN THE LINE.
WHAT IS THAT? THAT'S, YEAH, THAT'S A DUPLICATE OF THREE A.
SO I THINK THAT'S IT IS ALL RIGHT.
WE ARE STRIKING ITEM THREE F WELL, SO THERE WERE TWO DIFFERENT REFERRALS THOUGH.
THE FIRST ONE WAS COUNCILMAN BASS, AND THE SECOND ONE WAS, THAT'S ONE DUTTON.
SO I DO RECALL, I DON'T KNOW EXACTLY WHAT THE ISSUE WAS, BUT I DO RECALL THERE WAS A REQUEST SOMEWHAT DIFFERENT THAN THE INITIAL ONE.
I, I DON'T REMEMBER EXACTLY WHAT IT WAS.
SO WE CAN GO BACK AND LOOK, BUT THERE, THERE IS, I THINK A DIFFERENT, OH, SO WE CAN SMALLER SCALE TOPIC, BUT I THINK WE JUST LOOK AT MORE DETAILS ABOUT WHAT YEAH, IF YOU WANNA, YEAH, IF YOU WANNA REACH OUT TO COUNCILMAN DUTTON AND ASK HER WHAT EXACTLY SHE WANTED THERE, UM, WE'LL BE HAPPY TO THAT, BRING IT BACK AND THEN WE WILL MOVE ON TO 3G REVIEW CAR.
I SAID, I ALMOST SAID CARPET REVIEW,
[01:00:02]
CARPORT, ORDINANCE, FUN ON A BUN.SO AGAIN, AS, AS SCOPING, UM, WE'RE, WE'RE HERE TO MAKE SURE THAT WE UNDERSTAND, UH, WHAT THIS REFERRAL IS INTENDED TO ENCOMPASS.
UM, SO WE WILL COME BACK WITH RESEARCH.
SO PEOPLE PUT UP CARPORTS WITHOUT PERMITS,
SO, AND PEOPLE ENCLOSED CARPORTS AS WELL, MAKE OUT THEM.
ARE WE TALKING UN ACTIVITIES THAT ARE UNPERMITTED OR ACTIVITIES THAT ARE ILLEGAL? OR BOTH? BOTH.
SO, AND, UM, I'D LIKE, I'D LIKE SOME HISTORY.
SO THAT WAY WHEN SOMEONE CALLS ME AND SAYS, WELL, EVERYONE OF MY NEIGHBORS HAS A CARPORT, WHY CAN'T I GET A CARPORT? THEN I CAN SAY, WELL, IT CHANGED FROM THIS TO THIS IN THIS YEAR.
YOU KNOW, 17 YEARS AGO THERE WAS NO REGULATION FOR IT, AND YOUR NEIGHBOR PUT IN A CARPORT.
SO A LITTLE BIT OF MAKING SURE WE UNDERSTAND THE BACKGROUND OF WHAT THE ORDINANCE SAYS ABOUT CARPORTS.
AND SO THAT WOULD BE, THAT WOULD INCLUDE TOO, IF IT'S DAMAGED, IF IT NEEDS REPAIR, IF IT'S KINDA LIKE SIGNS, IF IT'S OVER A CERTAIN PERCENTAGE, YOU GOTTA TEAR IT DOWN AND REBUILD IT BACK TO CODE.
PERHAPS THAT MIGHT BE SOMETHING WE NEED TO DIG INTO.
WHAT ELSE? UM, APPEALS PROCESS FOR IT.
'CAUSE AGAIN, A LOT OF THIS, THIS, THIS DOESN'T HAPPEN WHEN SOME GUY'S THE FIRST HOME IN THEIR NEIGHBORHOOD PUTTING UP A CARPORT.
IT HAPPENS IN THE NEIGHBORHOODS WHERE THERE'S CARPORTS EVERYWHERE.
AND THE, THE MAIN ISSUE IS THAT THEY'RE CONSTRUCTING IT IN WHAT IS THE, BASICALLY THE, THE BUILDING SETBACK, RIGHT? SO IT'S, IT'S, IT PROTRUDES INTO THAT, RIGHT? SO IF FOR MANY YEARS YOU HAVE CARPORTS AND NO ONE EVER DID ANYTHING, YOU KNOW, IN A POSITION TO DO SOMETHING, THE, THE NEW HOMER THAT COMES IN AND SAYS, I WANT TO, I WANT TO PUT A CARPET.
WELL, MY NEIGHBORS HAVE IT, RIGHT? IT'S VERY DIFFICULT TO NOW SAY, OH, WELL WE'VE GOT RULES NOW, SO MM-HMM
WE'VE GOTTA LOOK AT THAT AND SEE HOW, HOW WE CAN, HOW CAN, HOW WE CAN, YOU KNOW, UH, TRANSITION FROM WHAT'S EXISTING TO WHAT CAN WE ALLOW, YOU KNOW, TODAY.
SO WHAT ARE WE, WHAT ARE WE ACTIVELY DOING FOR UNPERMITTED AND IMPROPER CARPORTS? ARE WE DOING ANYTHING ABOUT IT? TECHNICALLY, NO.
BECAUSE THERE'S LIKE A BILLION OF THEM, RIGHT? YEAH.
AND TO, TO, YOU KNOW, AND, AND, AND BY THE WAY, THIS IS NOT A PROBLEM IN, IN, I WAS GONNA SAY IN CORPUS.
IT'S NOT JUST A PROBLEM IN GARLAND.
BECAUSE YOU'RE DEALING WITH, BEFORE EVEN PEOPLE, MOST CITIES EVEN THOUGHT OF REGULATIONS TO NOW YOU'RE IN LIKE 20, 25.
AND, AND IT'S JUST A GAMUT ACROSS THE, ACROSS THE SPECTRUM, RIGHT? SO HOW WE APPROACH THAT, I CAN'T COME TO YOU AND SAY, YOU'VE GOTTA TAKE THIS DOWN, BUT WE'VE GOTTA BE A LITTLE MORE CREATIVE.
AND, AND IT, AND IT'S GENERALLY COMPLAINT DRIVEN, OBVIOUSLY.
BECAUSE IT'S HARD TO KNOW AS YOU'RE DRIVING ALONG, WHAT'S A LEGAL NON-CONFORMING STRUCTURE UNTIL SOMEBODY COMPLAINS OR IS IN DISREPAIR IS UNSAFE AND GETS SOMEBODY'S ATTENTION.
I THINK WE HAVE THAT ONE CAPTURED.
MY HOUSE HAD A CARPORT ON IT LONG BEFORE I EVER BOUGHT IT, AND IT WAS ENCLOSED AND NOT ENCLOSED.
WELL,
UM, THOSE, THOSE KINDS OF THINGS THAT, YOU KNOW, WE HAVE IN OUR, OUR BUILDING CODE.
IT, IT'S ONE OF THE MAJOR CHALLENGES ABOUT WHAT YOU'RE SAYING IS THAT CARPORTS HAVE BUILT ON THE PROPERTY LINE, RIGHT? MM-HMM
ANYTHING BUILT ON THE PROPERTY LINE HAS ALL KINDS OF BELLS AND WHISTLES THAT GO OUT THAT SAYS, HEY, YOU NEED TO DO SOMETHING.
AND PARTICULARLY IF YOU ENCLOSE IT, BECAUSE THE CODE BASICALLY SAYS, HEY, IF YOU HAVE A CARPO, IT'S SOMETHING ON THREE SIDES, NO PROBLEM.
BUT WHEN YOU ENCLOSE IT, NOW, IT'S KIND OF A PART OF THE STRUCTURE, AND SO IT'S GOTTA BE RATED.
SO IT'S JUST, IT, IT CAN GET AWAY FROM YOU VERY FAST.
SO WE JUST NEED TO LOOK AT IT AND SEE HOW WE WANT TO APPROACH IT GOING FORWARD IN THE FUTURE.
COMMITTEE, ANY MORE? ANY QUESTIONS, COMMENTS? NONE FROM ME.
I'M GLAD WE'RE LOOKING AT THIS.
GOING TO MOVE ON TO THE NEXT ITEM THREE H CODE, CODE OF ORDINANCES, 26.91.
DEFINITIONS TO INCLUDE FOOD ESTABLISHMENTS AND SIGNAGE SCOPING.
[01:05:03]
COUNCIL MEMBER BASS.YOU WERE A SECOND ON THIS ITEM.
DO YOU WANNA
I THOUGHT THE CARPORT ONE WAS MINE, BUT IT'S NOT.
YEAH, I'M NOT AWARE OF WHAT THE SPECIFIC, I DON'T RECALL WHAT THE, I, I THINK THIS WAS THE WAFFLE TRUCK.
WELL, WHAT IS CODE? CODE? OH, YES, I BELIEVE IT WAS, WHAT DOES THAT READ? IT WAS ABOUT THE WAFFLE TRUCK ON BROADWAY.
UM, SO I WILL YOU REACH OUT TO COUNCILWOMAN DUTTON AND ASK HER IF SHE WANTS TO, UH, CONTINUE WITH THIS DISCUSSION ON THAT ITEM? I, I THOUGHT, 'CAUSE THE CONVERSATION I HAD THAT NIGHT WITH, UM, BRIAN ENGLAND WAS REALLY, THAT THERE WAS NOTHING WE COULD DO.
NOW WHAT I, WHAT I DON'T KNOW IS THERE WAS, THERE WAS SOME RESOLUTION THAT, AND MITCH WAS MORE INVOLVED SINCE IT WAS HIS, ONE OF HIS DEPARTMENTS.
UM, YOU KNOW HOW THEY, HOW THEY GOT THERE, I DON'T KNOW.
BUT, BUT WITHOUT A DOUBT IT IN TERMS OF THAT, IT ENDS UP BEING A FREE SPEECHS ISSUE.
BUT LET'S MAKE SURE, SINCE SOME THINGS HAVE CHANGED SINCE THIS WAS ON HERE AND SOME ACTION MIGHT HAVE BEEN TAKEN, LET'S FIND OUT FOR SURE AND GET BACK WITH YOU.
UM, AND COMMITTEE, ARE THERE ANY, DO YOU HAVE ANY COMMENTS ON THAT ONE? OKAY.
THANK YOU FOR REMINDING US ABOUT THAT.
UM, ITEM THREE, I EVALUATE DESIGN ELEMENTS OF ANTENNAS SCOPING DISCUSSION.
COUNCILMAN THOMAS, THIS IS YOUR ITEM.
DO YOU WANNA GIVE EVERYBODY A SUMMARY? SURE.
SO WE, UH, HAD A MEETING, UH, A COUPLE OF WEEKS AGO, MEETINGS AGO, APPROVED A NEW ANTENNA MM-HMM
DOWN THERE OFF OF BRAND ROAD WHERE IT CROSSES, UH, UNDER GEORGE BUSH.
AND SO I HAD ASKED AT THE TIME ABOUT, UM, HAVING COME FROM A TRIP, RECENT TRIP FROM CALIFORNIA WHERE THEY DECORATE THEIR, UH, CELL PHONE AND, UH, TOWERS AS PALM TREES.
I DON'T KNOW IF PALM TREE WORKS REALLY GOOD, BUT, SO I STARTED GOOGLING AND, AND BRIAN SAID, WELL, YOU CAN'T REQUIRE THEM TO DO THAT.
THAT'S NOT, THAT'S RESTRICTING THEM UNFAIRLY AND THAT'S AGAINST THE LAW.
AND SO, BUT I'M WONDERING ABOUT, UM, IS THERE SOME WAY THAT WE COULD SEE ABOUT DOING SOME OF THAT AND WHAT, HOW MUCH THAT KIND OF THING COSTS? SO I DID A LITTLE GOOGLE SEARCHING AND IF YOU GOOGLE, UH, CONROE, TEXAS HAS WHAT THEY CALL WHAT THEY'RE CALLING THE MONO PINE AND THE CON, THERE'S THREE CONROE MONO PINES THAT ARE OUT THERE AND IT LOOKS LIKE PINE TREES.
AND SO I AM WONDERING IF THERE'S SOME SOMETHING THAT THE CITY COULD DO IF WE CAN'T REQUIRE THE, UH, THE PERSON ERECTING THE POLE TO DO ANYTHING.
IS THERE SOMETHING WE MIGHT WANT TO DO? AND WHAT, WHAT DOES THAT LOOK LIKE COST-WISE? I MEAN, PAINT THAT POLE AND THEN TO PUT SOME KIND OF DECORATION ON IT THAT MAKES IT LOOK LIKE A TREE IS WHAT I'M THINKING.
AND GO LOOK AT THE, YOU KNOW, THE CONROE MONO PINE PICTURES.
THEY, YOU KNOW, THEY LOOK PRETTY GOOD AND THEY KIND OF DON'T STAND OUT FROM A, FROM ALL THE OTHER PINE TREES THAT ARE AROUND THAT YOU, THAT YOU MIGHT EXPECT TO SEE IN EAST TEXAS.
AND WE'LL, WE'LL, WE'LL CONTINUE TO INVESTIGATE THAT.
I'M SIMILAR, I, I RECALL THAT DISCUSSION AND I DO THINK WHAT WE NEED TO DO IS WE'LL START WITH THE LEGAL PARAMETERS OF WHAT CAN AND CAN'T BE DONE.
I KNOW, I KNOW WHAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT.
THE, SO THAT PARTICULAR ANTENNA I, I SUSPECT IS A MONOPOLE, WHICH IS NOT THE KIND THAT HAS THE, THE, THE ARRAY OF ANTENNAS ON TOP.
UM, AND THOSE ARE, THE ANTENNAS ARE, IT'S A, IT'S A STRAIGHT MONOPOLE WHERE THE ANTENNAS ARE ENCASED IN, IN THE TOP OF IT, RATHER THAN THEM HAVING THEM SCATTERED ALL OVER THE TOP LOOKING LIKE OLD SCHOOL STUFF.
SO NOT, NOT ALL THE ANTENNAS IN TOWN ARE MONOPOLES THERE.
THERE'S SOME ARE MORE LESS ATTRACTIVE THAN THAT EVEN.
SO, UM, WE'LL, WE'LL START WITH THE LEGAL PARAMETERS.
I SUSPECT, YOU KNOW, ANY, ANY IMPROVEMENTS WE DO TO THOSE PRIVATE ASSETS WOULD REQUIRE THEIR, THEIR CONSENT AND ALL SORTS OF, WHO KNOWS WHAT KIND OF LEGAL THINGS.
BUT WE'LL CERTAINLY TALK ABOUT IT.
UM, YOU KNOW, I DON'T KNOW WHAT KIND OF ACE IS, OR, YOU KNOW, TREATMENTS THAT THEY WOULD ALLOW, EVEN IF WE DID HAVE FUNDS FOR IT THAT WOULD COME BACK AND DO THAT.
BUT WE'LL CERTAINLY INVESTIGATE IT AND, AND LOOK AT THE LEGAL PARAMETERS OF IT TOO.
'CAUSE THERE, THERE IS SOME PREEMPTION THERE THAT, THAT BRIAN DID TALK ABOUT.
I'M STILL INTERESTED IN HEARING WHAT LEGAL, WHAT ORDINANCE REQUIREMENTS WE COULD ATTACH TO THEM.
THAT'S WHERE I THINK WE'LL END UP GOING DOWN THE ROAD.
IS THERE MAY, CONROE CAN DO IT.
AND THE CONROE POLES, THEY STILL HAVE THE BIG FLAT THING
[01:10:01]
STICKING OUT AT THE VERY TOP.THEY'RE NOT OH, IT DOES, OKAY.
IT'S JUST SOMETHING STICKING OUT FROM THE BRANCHES.
AND SO, BUT FOR THE MOST OF IT, IT LOOKS LIKE BRANCHES ABOUT HALFWAY UP THAT FROM THE UPPER HALF OF THE POLE.
UM, BUT SO IT'S NO BY NO MEANS HIDES ALL OF THAT STUFF THAT YOU SEE ON A NORMAL CELL PHONE TOWER.
BUT, UM, ANYWAY, SO I JUST, YOU KNOW, SINCE WE COULDN'T, UH, REQUIRE THAT AS PART OF THE APPROVAL, I THOUGHT, WELL, WHAT ELSE COULD WE DO TO MAKE SOME OF THOSE A LITTLE MORE ATTRACTIVE AND MAKE 'EM KIND OF, AND KIND OF FADE INTO THE BACKGROUND ONCE YOU DO THAT.
SO, UH, WE WILL BE HAPPY TO RESEARCH THAT AND COME BACK.
AND SO THAT'S, YEAH, THAT'S ALL I WANTED TO SEE.
WHAT, WHAT, WHAT COULD WE DO ABOUT THAT? ANY, IF ANYTHING OKAY.
FOR THE RECORD, I'M OKAY WITH PALM TREES ALSO.
I WAS THINKING HACKBERRY FOR YOU WANNA PECAN? WE WE COULD DO PECAN.
YOU HAVE JUST WALKED INTO A EI YOU ARE INTO, IT'S, IT'S KERRY ENSIS.
HOW ABOUT THAT?
UM, WELL, WE DON'T REALLY DECIDE FUTURE AGENDA ITEMS ON THIS COMMITTEE.
GET EVERYBODY OUTTA HERE BY 5:00 PM IT IS 4 57 AND WE ARE ADJOURNED.